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Post by TheMazingerZ on Mar 27, 2013 17:47:19 GMT -5
I can't agree with that completely. I can say that one thing that made the 70's and 80's anime shows memorable was the mix of their story lines and the music used. Yes, there were a lot of anime made just to capitalize on the success of Mazinger Z and such, but they were not the norm back then, like they have been in the last two decades. }D
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Post by Chen on Mar 27, 2013 17:57:52 GMT -5
What's the point of making a cartoon or anime? It's to make money either through commercials or merchandise. It's been like that since the beginning of television, but that doesn't mean the shows didn't have passionate people involved who truly loved their job and craft. Granted there are much more forgettable shows then hit makers and honestly what clicks with a audience and what doesn't is a mystery still.
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Post by TheMazingerZ on Mar 27, 2013 18:36:59 GMT -5
Agree 100%. }D
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Post by plasmawing on Mar 27, 2013 21:09:54 GMT -5
What's the point of making a cartoon or anime? It's to make money either through commercials or merchandise. It's been like that since the beginning of television, but that doesn't mean the shows didn't have passionate people involved who truly loved their job and craft. Granted there are much more forgettable shows then hit makers and honestly what clicks with a audience and what doesn't is a mystery still. I can agree with that. Even merchandise-driven shows can be created by people who care about them. That's no less true now than it was back then. Either way, this is getting off topic. I think my original point was that the decline in SOC releases is probably also due to the fact that Bandai has already released SOCs of all of the more memorable classic super robots.
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Post by TheMazingerZ on Mar 27, 2013 21:17:56 GMT -5
But not really. An example is the Kotetsu Jeeg. A very famous and memorable Super Robot but zero SOC treatment. Another one would be Diapolon, Gordian, and Gakeen, which I understand are super popular in Europe. Also the newer Super Robots: Shin Getters, Dangaioh, SRX, GaoGaiGar, GaoFighGar, Mazinkaiser, Mazinkazer SKL, etc. There are a ton of Super Robots yet to be made in SOC form that have a very large fan base. }D
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Post by actionawesome on Mar 27, 2013 22:20:05 GMT -5
I wonder if the lack of SOC for some of these characters are due to licensing costs.
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Post by plasmawing on Mar 29, 2013 12:02:34 GMT -5
But not really. An example is the Kotetsu Jeeg. A very famous and memorable Super Robot but zero SOC treatment. Another one would be Diapolon, Gordian, and Gakeen, which I understand are super popular in Europe. Also the newer Super Robots: Shin Getters, Dangaioh, SRX, GaoGaiGar, GaoFighGar, Mazinkaiser, Mazinkazer SKL, etc. There are a ton of Super Robots yet to be made in SOC form that have a very large fan base. }D There are a lot of newer super robots that haven't had SOCs, but the SOC line primarily focuses on 70s and 80s robots. And some of newer robots you mentioned do have SRCs. I wonder if the lack of SOC for some of these characters are due to licensing costs. That might actually be the case with Kotetsu Jeeg. Takara, one of Bandai's biggest rivals, made the original toys for Jeeg, so that might have something to do with it. Of course, Takara was also a sponsor for the Brave series, and those are appearing as SRCs, so I could be completely wrong.
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Post by TheMazingerZ on Mar 29, 2013 13:43:35 GMT -5
Don't confuse SOC with SRC. Way different items. }D
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Post by plasmawing on Mar 29, 2013 16:43:34 GMT -5
Don't confuse SOC with SRC. Way different items. }D I'm aware that they're different lines. But it seems like the SOC line was meant to focus on classic super robots, while the SRC line is for newer robots. There are some exceptions, but for the most part newer super robots fall outside of the scope of the SOC line. As far as I know, Mazinger Z, Shin Mazinger, Great Mazinger, Grendizer, and the upcoming Big O are the only robots that have both an SOC and an SRC.
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Post by B- on Mar 29, 2013 19:29:47 GMT -5
Don't confuse SOC with SRC. Way different items. }D I'm aware that they're different lines. But it seems like the SOC line was meant to focus on classic super robots, while the SRC line is for newer robots. There are some exceptions, but for the most part newer super robots fall outside of the scope of the SOC line. As far as I know, Mazinger Z, Shin Mazinger, Great Mazinger, Grendizer, and the upcoming Big O are the only robots that have both an SOC and an SRC. I agree with that.Been saying it forever,thats why wishing for any Super Robot in the SOC line with an anime later than 1988 will never happen.Gunbuster came out in 88 and that is the latest anime related to an SOC.I dont count Evangelion{1995}it is the fluke,and not an SR anyhow. Here is the complete list of Classic style Super Robots still not made by any modern company dates from 1972-1985 which are the true years of SRs as far as Im concerned.There are only 11 to choose from.So either SOC makes a Mazinkaiser,Shin Getter or remakes of ones already done,they have a very short list of classic types.Yes there are other Robot animes between these years but all are nondescript type Gundam wannabe stuff with little style,or uniqueness.These are the Mazinger,Jeeg,Grendizer type classics or closely related below.The below robots have not been made in plastic or diecast ever in modern times{post 1997} I am using the excellent book Super Robot Chronicles as reference on dates. Diapolon 1976 Daikengo 1979 Tryder G-7 1980 Acrobunch 1982 Rainbowman 1982 Albegas 1983 {soon to be made by ET} Govarian 1983 Laserion 1984 Gorg 1984 God Mazinger 1984 Bismarck 1984
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Post by TheMazingerZ on Mar 30, 2013 0:40:40 GMT -5
But unfortunately Evas are part of the SOC line no matter what, and pretty early too. I always said no entry should be made into the SOC unless they were actually classic Super Robots, but then came the Evas, Sentai, King Joe, Yamato & Andromeda, Baikanfu, and the Ninja Robots. So this leds me to think that SOC is open to put anything in there, not only classics with "soul". }D
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Post by xTIMMYxCOREx on Mar 30, 2013 0:56:42 GMT -5
It's weird because the Macross chogokin are not SOC, not is the LODM Gaiking, and my chogokin Buzz Lightyear. But EVAs are and the Yamato was (though the first one was SOP), as well as the newer Getter Dragon and Shin Mazinger Z. I don't understand the rationale.
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Post by actionawesome on Mar 30, 2013 10:38:45 GMT -5
Unfortunately the LODM Gaiking does not look like the one in the anime in my opinion. Best sculpt/paint goes to the Revoltech one. Maybe someday we will get a sweet SRC of that one.
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Post by gokinrob on Mar 30, 2013 12:17:53 GMT -5
Anyone notice that the cost of figures / SOC/ SRC/ Figma/ et al., is going UP? That is the key, IMO. Economics.
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Post by actionawesome on Mar 30, 2013 12:34:28 GMT -5
Well, the cost of METALS is going up. I used to be able to do metal castings in pewter for a 1/4 of the price now. Materials are just more expensive.
Unless you are happy paying for cheaper materials. I suspect none of us are.
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Post by cupnoodles on Mar 30, 2013 12:54:33 GMT -5
A chogokin probably has less metal than a frying pan, and frying pan prices seem pretty steady. So it could be the labor, i heard Mexico and China will have the same labor costs in a few years.
it does seem like MSRPs are rising but retailers like amazon jp are offering 20-35% discounts.
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Post by Chen on Mar 30, 2013 12:58:25 GMT -5
It's the cost of plastic now that's shot up, it's a petroleum based resource and like gasoline is finite. As Josh stated when he talked to a Hasbro exec. when creating a toy they are actually weighing the figure right down to grams and trying to find ways of making figures as light as possible while still trying to maintain size and design.
It's all about weight, metal is probably going to end being cheaper to produce toys in but then you have to pay for the extra weight through more fuel being used to transport it. Toys will be heavier but also have to pass current safety laws, it's tough. Economic climates, labor costs, nature, are all factors plus the fact that all resources are finite unless they start making SOC's outta wood lol.
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Post by Mr. Ginrai on Mar 30, 2013 13:31:38 GMT -5
Everyone brought up valid reasons above, but you also have to remember that mold costs for masters are staggering, especially for the ones that have to last through mass production runs, several recolors, or are just for high quality toys in general.
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Post by Chen on Mar 30, 2013 15:23:47 GMT -5
True molds costs thousands of dollars and a mold for a metal part and the same part in plastic will be different with extra steps or details needed for a metal part mold. Also making parts outta diecast means you need to take that extra step of painting it whereas most plastic parts are molded in color.
I will add another factor many don't know but I deal with a ton of certification that many products have to pass to be sold or used in different parts of the world. The list of banned substances from say the EU is staggering and increases every year and covers pretty much everything except Military products. So say Bandai wants to sell a toy in Sweden they have to make sure that every single item that's in that toy including the packaging has to meet EU standards. So the ink that's on the instructions to the tape used to seal that box is under scrutiny and the standards are different all over the world. So standard in the States are different from the ones used in China to the ones used in Germany. And they all have to deal with what happens to the items and package once its thrown in the dump and its health and safety effects. Its quite a process.
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Post by ryomakabuto on Apr 2, 2013 12:32:11 GMT -5
Toy manufacturers should be investing in 3D printing technology. Molds are not needed in 3D printing, but right now it is slow and expensive. The technology needs to be improved, but once it is it should be cheaper to produce parts.
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