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Post by locidm on Oct 20, 2017 20:21:32 GMT -5
Wait WEP approved the license? I haven't heard that before and was certain that WEP wouldn't.
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Post by Coletron on Oct 20, 2017 22:03:19 GMT -5
Wait WEP approved the license? I haven't heard that before and was certain that WEP wouldn't. Yep. Josh B shows the WEP logo on the back of the Black Lion in the review. I was surprised, too. |
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Post by locidm on Oct 20, 2017 22:56:30 GMT -5
I don't think that means WEP approved it. Miracle production did the same thing with Vehicle Voltron. Earlier in this thread faleon has excerpt of an email explicitly stating this release does not have their approval or licensing. I think it just means they are blatantly violating WEP copyright on Voltron.
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Post by thayora on Oct 20, 2017 23:07:01 GMT -5
I don't think that means WEP approved it. Miracle production did the same thing with Vehicle Voltron. Earlier in this thread faleon has excerpt of an email explicitly stating this release does not have their approval or licensing. I think it just means they are blatantly violating WEP copyright on Voltron. From a representative of WEP: For the record, and to satisfy those who keep accusing me of "Speculation", I contacted WEP to ask if KOB was licensed and legit. My curiosity got the better of me. Their response; XXXX- it is not legit, a shame they can get away with this. Thanks for the email! Tiffany Ilardi Head of Licensing WEP, LLC. 50 Maryland Plaza, Suite 300 St. Louis, MO 63108 314-345-1060 <redacted personal info>@wep.com www.voltron.comAnd now knowing this, any possibility or interest I had in purchasing one just died. While I generally try to give my purchase dollars to the legitimate vendors, I will occasionally pick up a unique but unlicensed piece. But I don't pay thieves. Look at that picture of the box for the Black KOB. Look in the lower Right Corner. See the Trademark markings? (Which they likely cut and pasted off of the GX-71 box as the fonts and print line up exactly). Yeah that one simple thing put on the box changes things entirely. It's no longer a "third party" or "unlicensed" or "Bootleg". It's now COUNTERFEIT! Even the classic Lionbot bootleggers had the good sense to not put Popy or Matchbox's trademarks on the box. And from BBTS: Personally, I have no interest in this figure, but I hate the thought of anyone being on the hook for 300 bucks. I Got this straight from BBTS: From what I was informed after discussing this internally, these products were offered to us from a reliable vendor who typically would not offer something that is not licensed. BBTS strives to only offer authentic products and we obviously prefer to avoid a product if there is a licensing complication. Therefore, I have been informed that the items in reference have since been temporarily removed from our website so that we can confirm with both the vendor as well as WEP that the items can be sold as is. If there is any sort of issue, we will permanently remove these listings and cancel preorders accordingly. Unfortunately, from what I've learned thus far, things are leaning more towards being canceled and removed versus being republished.Whereas 3P Transformers aren't dumb enough to claim they're officially licensed, KOB V2 is. But yeah, there is a lot pointing that this isn't an officially licensed product and that the claims of being one and having false claims of it printed on the box, makes this thing an easy target to shoot. |
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Post by Coletron on Oct 20, 2017 23:17:42 GMT -5
I don't think that means WEP approved it. Miracle production did the same thing with Vehicle Voltron. Earlier in this thread faleon has excerpt of an email explicitly stating this release does not have their approval or licensing. I think it just means they are blatantly violating WEP copyright on Voltron. You could be right. But in the beginning, the MA-01 was licensed by WEP. It was after endless delays, QC problems and reissues that WEP sued Miracle Metal Works and pulled the license. I've followed this thread, and faelon knows way more about this stuff than I do. But Josh B and other reviewers say it's a legit Voltron. |
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Post by Coletron on Oct 20, 2017 23:26:44 GMT -5
I just sent an email to WEP via the Voltron Shop, asking if the Icarus Dark Voltron is officially licensed or not. So, We'll see....
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Post by locidm on Oct 21, 2017 0:09:01 GMT -5
I hope you hear back from them but looks like we will have at least the weekend to continue speculating!
If CDX is claiming this is officially licensed product solely based on the logo on the box and the toy, I wouldn't bet on it.
Thinking from WEP perspective, granting Icarus license is sort of like hiring someone who they know stole from them as their security guard. It makes no sense. Sure Icarus isn't the same as the company who did KOB v1, but the mold and design was done with stolen IP to begin with.
However, since it is WEP we are talking about and they've done some boneheaded things before, if the license was somehow granted to Icarus then perhaps it explains why Bandai is pissed and has not reissued the SOC Voltron. It could also be the reason behind the delayed announcement of GX-76. It certainly makes a good story!
Anyway I hope we learn from Icarus whether this is licensed or not. If this is indeed blatant copyright infringement then I hope CDX would correct their videos and write ups accordingly to avoid spreading false news.
If this is official then I hope it doesn't impact Bandai's future plans on any Voltron products. I would love a SOC Dairugger or Albegas!
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Post by locidm on Oct 21, 2017 0:19:41 GMT -5
lol I just saw faleon's comment on CDX. You go tell them good man. Good work.
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Post by thayora on Oct 21, 2017 1:04:15 GMT -5
I hope you hear back from them but looks like we will have at least the weekend to continue speculating! If CDX is claiming this is officially licensed product solely based on the logo on the box and the toy, I wouldn't bet on it. Thinking from WEP perspective, granting Icarus license is sort of like hiring someone who they know stole from them as their security guard. It makes no sense. Sure Icarus isn't the same as the company who did KOB v1, but the mold and design was done with stolen IP to begin with. However, since it is WEP we are talking about and they've done some boneheaded things before, if the license was somehow granted to Icarus then perhaps it explains why Bandai is pissed and has not reissued the SOC Voltron. It could also be the reason behind the delayed announcement of GX-76. It certainly makes a good story! Anyway I hope we learn from Icarus whether this is licensed or not. If this is indeed blatant copyright infringement then I hope CDX would correct their videos and write ups accordingly to avoid spreading false news. If this is official then I hope it doesn't impact Bandai's future plans on any Voltron products. I would love a SOC Dairugger or Albegas! which was quite a while before Bandai announced the SOC. I'm pretty sure GX-76 is gonna be another Dynamic Classic. Dairugger is something that Bandai is aware that people really want in the SOC line so I hope they'll do that soon in the future. |
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Post by smokinchogokin on Oct 21, 2017 3:53:10 GMT -5
There's debate as to whether they actually got the license. I personally don't care if it's legal. I love it!
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Post by S_Gokin on Oct 21, 2017 10:09:46 GMT -5
There's debate as to whether they actually got the license. I personally don't care if it's legal. I love it! EXACTLY  couldn't careless about that, if its a good Gokin (and its) i will get it that's all i care about it  |
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Post by FixedInPost on Oct 21, 2017 11:07:26 GMT -5
Gotta say, the firing gimmicks on this are a HUGE plus for me. Nice to see someone paying attention to this. Sad to see Bandai getting away from gimmicks. Playability is still a big factor for me even if I don’t “play” with a figure.
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Post by thayora on Oct 21, 2017 16:23:34 GMT -5
It's not that I doubt it's a good gokin, it's just that it's more of something that people should know about the troubles it can bring because of false trademarks.
But moreover, that BU/Icarus/Whoever was claiming to be licensed before Bandai announced the SOC, so there's not disagreement or whatnot going behind the curtains preventing a Dairugger SOC.
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Post by S_Gokin on Oct 21, 2017 23:15:27 GMT -5
It's not that I doubt it's a good gokin, it's just that it's more of something that people should know about the troubles it can bring because of false trademarks. But moreover, that BU/Icarus/Whoever was claiming to be licensed before Bandai announced the SOC, so there's not disagreement or whatnot going behind the curtains preventing a Dairugger SOC. troubles to who exactly ? as a consumer you are on the safe side, transformers have tons and tons of unlicensed products and it have the exact same looks and packaging of the original things, yet no one said anything, but when a company bring the Voltron of our dreams suddenly every one is upset because its not licensed ? i really dont know why you guys are so obsessed with that piece of paper while you should be more focused on the figure it self, most of the hardcore Voltron fans who got sick of the crappy releases dont care ,and no one will ever care if they got the approval or not, all they want is a decent modern version of Voltron and MT delivered that exactly it was the best Voltron toy for 3 years, even when the SOC got released the KOB hold its ground respectfully and with this new figure serve as a reminder why this thing was the best, in matter of fact i think people who missed the SOC will hunt down the new KOB because its the second best |
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Post by locidm on Oct 21, 2017 23:48:37 GMT -5
with miracle vehicle Voltron there were multiple reports of people getting warning emails when they tried to sell it on eBay. So there is a legitimate concern.
In general people don't like being lied to. I have no problem with the toy or whether it's unlicensed. But it offends me if the company is trying to deceive consumers by stamping an official logo when it's not licensed. Jury is still out regarding its licensing.
Anyway, I think the point of the previous posts about licensing is more about finding the truth and letting people know about it than bashing the actual product. If the toy is in fact unlicensed but being marketed otherwise, the consumer should know about it before making a decision. Don't people have rights to know about what they're spending money on?
If the toy is in fact licensed then perhaps even more collectors would be willing to spend the dough. So it's beneficial however you look at it to know whether it's in fact a licensed toy or not.
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Post by smokinchogokin on Oct 22, 2017 6:05:03 GMT -5
The way I see it is WEP basically sucks and has not done what they need to w the property that is Voltron. Toynami is awful. I own a few of their voltron and they aren't very good figures. WEP licensed playmates for legendary defender and we got one awesome huge plastic combiner and a bunch of garbage. The basic line stinks, the paladins don't look like the characters they're supposed to be, the die cast is a slap in the face. WEP has licensed ONE amazing high end Gokin and that's the GX-71. Correct me if I'm wrong. Who's in charge at WEP? Sorry WEP, If you can't handle this incredible property better then I'll gladly pay ICARUS for their outstanding efforts.
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Post by S_Gokin on Oct 22, 2017 9:11:53 GMT -5
i remember one case long ago, when a member wanted so sell his, and he got a sketchy email from some one calming to be from WEB and they asked him to just give them the figure and where did he got it from, lol ok from what i remember he sold it later with ease but i will go with your point of view, you must be smart enough not to offer it in those kind of places, you have ton of other platforms to sell it in in peace, for example Instagram till today i still get crazy offers for my KOB, last one was so good i almost sold it lol, but naaah thats a unique piece of history and its not for sale and yea people should know what they are buying, and most of people who will get it wont care much about the license because they are buying a great gokin, also we still dont know for sure what happened with them, they had a pre approval or something like that, then it went dark lol last thing we live in the Goolge era so simply if you are not sure about anything google it |
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Post by faelon on Oct 22, 2017 19:37:03 GMT -5
I don't think that means WEP approved it. Miracle production did the same thing with Vehicle Voltron. Earlier in this thread faleon has excerpt of an email explicitly stating this release does not have their approval or licensing. I think it just means they are blatantly violating WEP copyright on Voltron. You could be right. But in the beginning, the MA-01 was licensed by WEP. It was after endless delays, QC problems and reissues that WEP sued Miracle Metal Works and pulled the license. I've followed this thread, and faelon knows way more about this stuff than I do. But Josh B and other reviewers say it's a legit Voltron. MA-01 was a little more complex than that. MM didn't have a license. But they were in negotiations regarding one. WEP was willing to extend the license, but MM was not far enough along in development to show a viable mock up or prototype. So there was a tentative informal agreement provided MM could come back with something to show. MM took much too long, and by the time they came back Mattel had swooped in and picked up the license. It's a problem smaller companies can face regarding licensing. Licenses are expensive. If you don't have infinite funds you don't want to be paying for them when you aren't ready to proceed. But in not locking yourself into the license it leaves the door open for someone else to come in and buy it. After all selling the license is how the licensor makes their money. It isn't earning for them while you try and get your act together. |
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Post by faelon on Oct 22, 2017 19:53:42 GMT -5
I hope you hear back from them but looks like we will have at least the weekend to continue speculating! If CDX is claiming this is officially licensed product solely based on the logo on the box and the toy, I wouldn't bet on it. Thinking from WEP perspective, granting Icarus license is sort of like hiring someone who they know stole from them as their security guard. It makes no sense. Sure Icarus isn't the same as the company who did KOB v1, but the mold and design was done with stolen IP to begin with. However, since it is WEP we are talking about and they've done some boneheaded things before, if the license was somehow granted to Icarus then perhaps it explains why Bandai is pissed and has not reissued the SOC Voltron. It could also be the reason behind the delayed announcement of GX-76. It certainly makes a good story! Anyway I hope we learn from Icarus whether this is licensed or not. If this is indeed blatant copyright infringement then I hope CDX would correct their videos and write ups accordingly to avoid spreading false news. If this is official then I hope it doesn't impact Bandai's future plans on any Voltron products. I would love a SOC Dairugger or Albegas! I had gotten a few responses in conversations with Tiffany Illardi. WEP's head of merchandising. She made it abundantly clear that no neither they, nor any Sub licensors had any business with Icarus or Mad Toys. This was also later confirmed with e-mails from BBTS when they looked into the mater and subsequently pulled the listing. The information e-mail for WEP is wep@wep.com. It may take a few days to hear back. As for WEP being in some way a bad company? WEP is in every way possible the polar opposite of something like Harmony Gold. They gave kept the property active. Turned a forgotten anime into a global up. Maintained good relations with Toei throughout. Their biggest flaw is they are a small "Mom and Pop" private company, and tend to be fiercely loyal to business partners. Hence why they stuck with Toynami for so long. This is not actually a true negative in context. By all accounts they are incredibly nice people to work or deal with... so long as you're not, y'know, stealing from them. They get a little b*tchy about that. And to remind all, because some straw men just won't die, there is no equivalency between what Mad Toys/Icarus did hear and 3p Transformers. 3p don't claim to be the product or IP they are mimicking. UG-00 does. There is unlicensed grey area. There is Bootleg. And there is Counterfeit. 3p is generally the first (occasionally crossing the line to #2). This thing is #3. It's counterfeit product, the same as a fake Gucci bag or a Rolex. |
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Post by thayora on Oct 22, 2017 22:14:15 GMT -5
Yeah, it's more of WEP being loyal to business partners that aren't exactly up to our taste.
Anyway, like people say over and over again, it is a good gokin officially licensed or not. But that doesn't really matter if the whole false trademark claims makes it a really risky investment. And the full color version would've been a nice alternative to the SOC for those who missed out, but again - a lot of risk in that now that WEP is very aware of what UG is doing.
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