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Post by KumaStyle.com (TJ) on Jan 30, 2020 13:50:35 GMT -5
Here is what happened;
- I received the product with glaring paint chips and flecks, and scuffs throughout and messaged the seller with pictures.
- The seller stated that his copy wasn't like that and he didn't notice the defects on the one he sold me. I asked him if he'd be ok swapping the bodies if he was personally ok with them (He was selling his extra.) He declined.
- He offered a return/refund to which I said ok, and then after thinking about it said what if this dude's already spent the money? So for the sake of keeping the peace I told him I'd take the L and deal with it. Not worth any potential drama. At that point I was done with it like whatever I still have another Amazon preorder coming end of Feb.
- The seller then offered a partial refund for whatever reason and I figured it was because he wasn't ok with the defects so I said ok and took the refund. Again I thought I was done. He went beyond to make right when he wasn't even asked to.
- A day later I got a pm from him saying that (in short form) he asked another collector (who I won't name as I also pmd PMd him amongst others to see if his copy had the same discrepancies and his did not) and how he and that collector were ok with the discrepancies on mine (the other collector did not say this) and that he gave a partial refund due to pressure (how was he pressured when I said I'd deal with it and didn't ask for anything.)
- I then responded asking if he was ok with how mine looked why didn't he swapped the bodies and why he volunteered to refund after I said I'd just deal with it.
No, I did not go over the condition that I received my copy in in the review because since it wasn't the norm from what I got from the seller as well as other owners I figured it wasn't fair to put it out there. Is it a review about a product or a video complaint about a seller? I'm not going to apologize for professionalism and being objective.
My question which I asked to gingao in messaging and now will ask publically is if the paint defects were ok in your opinion why were you willing to partial refund over exchanging the bodies? It's pretty clear that you hold the condition of your own collection to a higher standard than you feel that people you sell things to should be. That's sh*tty and then to turn it as if something happened to you when you voluntarily offered and gave a partial refund is extra sh*tty. I was going to leave it alone in public but now that you've brought it up and it's out there that's shady asf. Who are you to tell me that I should sit up, mope, and b*tch about something vs. making the best of it?
And @gingao if you're wanting to say that I'm being dishonest about a thing written here post the conversation in full.
You're not blocked there or anywhere else btw so I don't even know where that came from. I said in my last response that I was leaving that conversation because it was becoming borderline offensive so where is the confusion? It's also like you saying here I called you a liar when I didn't and even told you in conversation I didn't but apologized for making you feel that way. Edit: I told you I took the high road by saying I'll keep it vs returning it, not by accepting your refund (what are you even talking about here?) And also there was no threat of a paypal claim; when you offered the return and refund I stated clearly that if we did that I'd like to do it through Paypal because they cover return shipping and neither of us have to. Lots of screwed up twisting so please yes, **please** post the conversation in full.
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Post by KumaStyle.com (TJ) on Jan 30, 2020 15:23:49 GMT -5
While we're waiting for that, Ryoma74 over at Gokin.it forums posted a number of pictures directly comparing this to the old CMS. Obviously it's not a fair comparison but it's a nice look at where things have come as well as some of the pics giving me a bit more respect for the amount of detail the CMS DOES have. The poster commonly reposts things he found online and it doesn't state where they originally came from so I don't know. Also not direct linking for respect of their bandwidth and it being a good number of pics; www.gokin.it/forum/viewtopic.php?f=54&t=7550&start=360#p176418
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Post by gingaio on Jan 30, 2020 16:24:06 GMT -5
I received the product with glaring paint chips and flecks, and scuffs throughout and messaged the seller with pictures. Glaring, huh? If that's your opinion, okay. You're entitled to your perspective. And it's why I offered you BOTH a full and partial refund. However, why, after receiving the partial refund, did you go on to publicly announce on TFW2005 that the toy I sent you was "top-to-bottom quality in terms of build and presentation," that "it took you a WHOLE 30 seconds to know that Goshogun is incredible," and, "that the paint job is pretty immaculate" (in your video review)? Why towards the end of our conversation did you acknowledge "a moment of clarity" regarding these minor factory issues and admit that you were wrong to come at me the way you did? Why did you then publicly give me props for sending you a "hot piece" quickly, and then delete said props after I privately called you out?
You can criticize a toy's factory QC (assuming it actually bugged you that much) without criticizing the seller who delivered you your toy, so your excuse for not talking about flaws in your reviews/posts makes no sense. IMO, you're giving a poor excuse to explain away the strange inconsistencies in your opinions.
Regarding the paint defects, bubbling, etc..., I never ignored your complaints about them. In fact, another collector mentioned very similar (same?) issues here: www.tfw2005.com/boards/threads/pose-metal-discussion.1165764/page-5. He called them "slight QC" issues.
QC errors with Art Storm is a norm, not out of the ordinary. But to make it seem like I sold you a particularly sh*tty copy and to use that as pretext for accepting and keeping such a large refund, and to not mention anything about the QC in any public comments on any forums, that's something else.
The seller stated that his copy wasn't like that and he didn't notice the defects on the one he sold me. I asked him if he'd be ok swapping the bodies if he was personally ok with them (He was selling his extra.) He declined. The first statement is a lie. I never stated my copy was different from yours. You mentioned a number of lines on the back of the robot, and I said, "I have those lines on the back of my copy, too. Regarding [your] minor scuffs...as I said, if there are things I've overlooked, okay, fine. But most toys I have--even brand new ones--have some kind of paint imperfection."
When you asked to exchange your copy for mine, I said, "I can't guarantee that there isn't something on my copy that'll bother you," since you were already nitpicking the heck out of the copy I sent you, and I didn't want to risk spending more money on shipping another copy just to get the same response. Also, somebody had inquired about buying my remaining copy--which I did eventually sell--and I was already thinking about selling it while talking to you.
He offered a return/refund to which I said ok, and then after thinking about it said what if this dude's already spent the money? So for the sake of keeping the peace I told him I'd take the L and deal with it. Not worth any potential drama. At that point I was done with it like whatever I still have another Amazon preorder coming end of Feb.
So you didn't trust me enough to return it? Another lie, especially since you'd already threatened to file a PayPal claim against me and were actually threatening to return it to me. Still, I offered you BOTH the option of a partial refund AND returning the toy to me at my own cost. And here was your actual response after you calmed down: "No, I don't want to return, man. It's not even worth the hassle. You're good people and like I said I'm not in this to take money out of pockets." So which am I, untrustworthy scum or "good people?"
The seller then offered a partial refund for whatever reason and I figured it was because he wasn't ok with the defects so I said ok and took the refund. Again I thought I was done. He went beyond to make right when he wasn't even asked to.
"For whatever reason?" Seriously? You think I go around offering $100 partial refunds after every deal? You completely forgot how much hell you raised over PM regarding the "defects" with this toy that you now love so much? Personally, I thought you were hyping up problems with the toy, which, based on all your subsequent reviews, you were. However, I didn't want to end on a sour note, especially as we're both collectors. This is what I offered you: "If you're open to it, I'll send you $100 as a partial refund (gift payment), and you can keep it. But if you want, you can also send it back and I'll make you whole on this."
A day later I got a pm from him saying that (in short form) he asked another collector (who I won't name as I also pmd PMd him amongst others to see if his copy had the same discrepancies and his did not) and how he and that collector were ok with the discrepancies on mine (the other collector did not say this) and that he gave a partial refund due to pressure (how was he pressured when I said I'd deal with it and didn't ask for anything.) - I then responded asking if he was ok with how mine looked why didn't he swapped the bodies and why he volunteered to refund after I said I'd just deal with it.
So your main point is that to fully prove my innocence, I should have offered to exchange my copy, which you believe was better based on NO evidence, after I already offered to let your return your copy or to give you a partial refund for it. I never told you that my copy was better. I told you that the copy I sent you was originally intended as a back-up copy for my display copy, that I inspected it to make sure nothing was missing or broken or otherwise wrong, and that I was selling because it was too expensive to keep as a back-up. I said the paint looked good to me, and it did (to my eyes, not to my camera's view on close-up under bright lights).
No, I did not take ultra-close-up shots of the inside of the elbow under bright lighting for the sake of finding errors--as you did--so if I missed things, then I was willing to make right on them.
In my own defense, though, you said this, "Yea, I'm admittedly pretty anal mostly because I'm a photographer and my camera picks up EVERYTHING but I have a lot of stuff from this lines parent company Art Storm and looking over the years there are a decent amount of scrapes and scuffs I've gotten new out of the box."
As for the "other collector," I asked if his copy had the lines on the back that you were complaining about and he said it did, just as my copy did. He did not corroborate anything else, as I did not ask about other things, but if I gave the impression that he had, then I was wrong, and I apologize to him for that.
You're not blocked there or anywhere else btw so I don't even know where that came from. I said in my last response that I was leaving that conversation because it was becoming borderline offensive so where is the confusion?
Again, not true. In your last message, you wrote, "I'm just going to leave the conversation and turn off receipt of future messages." (this basically means that you selected the option to not receive future messages from me. TFW2005 notifed me that you had "permanently left the conversation." If I'm wrong on this, then feel free to correct me.
My question which I asked to gingao in messaging and now will ask publically is if the paint defects were ok in your opinion why were you willing to partial refund over exchanging the bodies? It's pretty clear that you hold the condition of your own collection to a higher standard than you feel that people you sell things to should be. That's sh*tty and then to turn it as if something happened to you when you voluntarily offered and gave a partial refund is extra sh*tty. I was going to leave it alone in public but now that you've brought it up and it's out there that's shady asf.
Your suspicion that I somehow intentionally sold you a copy inferior to my own is just based on your own fears. I can't disprove them anymore than I can stop someone from being paranoid. I told you what I told you, and you can believe or doubt me. But I never gave you cause to think I was trying to cheat you of anything. If anything, I'm the one that's out $100 on this deal, and yet you have the audacity to call me shady. Regarding why I chose not to spend more money to gamble exchanging copies with a hyper-obsessive, prickly, and short-tempered collector with a zoom lens and harsh lighting, I addressed that above.
And gingao if you're wanting to say that I'm being dishonest about a thing written here post the conversation in full.
I can't believe you're actually asking for this. As you wish. I'm redacting names/addresses only, but everything I quoted above can be found in the conversation below. ---------------------------------------------------------------------------
KS: I'll take it. What's the shipping damage to ___________?
G: Box is oversized, so USPS will charge a premium for Priority Mail.
Dimensions are 18" x 14" x 8", and weight is about 5.5 lbs.
Priority Mail (3-5 days), includes for up to $50 = $51.80 Retail Ground (7-9 days) = $26.10 Signature Confirmation = $3.00 Insurance (for Retail Ground) = depends on what we insure it for.
If the Priority postage is too high, what we can do is ship it Retail Ground and include insurance.
I already packed it as carefully as I could (box is bubble-wrapped with extra bubble-wrap on each side to create space within the shipping box).
LMK if you have any questions, and thanks for your interest.
G: Also, normally if it's a standard PayPal payment, I ask the buyer to cover the 3.5% fee. If a gift/family/friends payment, then no fee.
Insurance and signature confirmation are up to you. Either shipping option will automatically come with tracking. Thanks!
KS: I'll do priority and it's 2.9%+ .$.40. I have a paypal payment calculator that does it to the penny so no worries there. Is payment Friday ok? I can do it first thing in the AM just drop your paypal address here. The goal is to get it by Monday so is shipping it out on Friday possible?
KS: And just to confirm the total due to you is $381.80, correct?
G: Yes, you can send payment Friday, and I can ship Friday if you get it to me that morning (I'm assuming you'll be up before I go to work). I'll ship Priority, and it's usually pretty fast, but I can't control any delays on the PO's part. So if you want guaranteed by Monday, I would recommend paying before Friday. Up to you.
I know the PayPal fee's 2.9% + $0.30. The reason I round up to 3.5% is that when you send someone the exact PayPal fee on top of the stated price, PayPal takes a percentage of the final higher price, so the seller always gets a little less than the intended price. For example, if you send $9 (2.9% + $0.30) for a $300 figure, PayPal will take a percentage of $309 and the seller will get $299.70.
3.5% means the seller gets a little more rather than a little less...when there's extra on my end, I usually just return it to the buyer as a gift payment anyway. In this case, the difference isn't worth anything to me, but I sometimes sell a bunch of stuff, so I was asking 3.5% out of habit.
The total is $381.80 if it's a gift/family/friends payment. Please add $11.47 (2.9% + $0.3) if a standard PayPal payment for a total of $393.27.
Thank you.
G: I missed what you said here..."I'll do priority and it's 2.9%+ .$.40. I have a paypal payment calculator that does it to the penny so no worries there."
Yeah, that's fine. I'll finish packing and have it ready to ship out to you on Friday after I receive payment. Just LMK where to ship to if the address/name aren't on the PayPal payment/account.
Thanks.
KS: I'm not trying to be funny but the whole percent thing isn't really pertinent to anything. Just be assured that you will get the exact amount that you are charging. Personally I use the following calculator to make sure I make and receive payments to the penny: PayPal Fee Calculator | Salecalc.com
This isn't be crass or dismissive but when conducting business I prefer to keep conversation focused on the item and getting it paid for/shipped rather than nuances like the total which was established at the very beginning of conversation. To further this point notice that I asked for your paypal address to have it available and that wasn't relayed. If you could let me know that I will have your payment first thing Friday. My address is also correct on Paypal.
(Edit: And just a heads up the amount sent will be $393.51 for you to get the correct amount to the penny.)
G: [Sends PayPal ID]
KS: Jesus I guess we're 1:1 with missing messages because I completely didn't see the second message. If I could get your paypal address though that'd be awesome. My bad there and thank you.
Why'd you order two if you don't mind?
KS: Following up ref the two figures question!
And it looks like I MIGHT be able to pay Thurs so fingers crossed.
G: For figures/characters I have a connection to, I sometimes buy a backup. In this case, I decided my one copy was good enough. Plus it wasn't cheap.
KS: That's fair. Everything check out on the extra? Just wanting to make sure it's mint as if bought brand spankin new.
I buy multiples of literally everything so it's always interesting when I meet others that do it too!
G: Yeah, everything looks fine. No paint issues that I could tell. The forearm guards have a little bit of rotation/swivel. On my copy, the right one is looser than the left. I checked the other copy and it's the same thing, so I think it's just the mold. Doesn't really affect anything, since the rotation is limited in either direction (not 360) and the guards are secured to the forearm well. They don't slide up or down.
If you do find any issues I've overlooked, I'll take responsibility for making it right with you. I expect, though, that your copy will function as well as mine.
KS: I really appreciate you saying that andI think I'm going to try to move some stuff around and get this paid tomorrow... what's the absolute soonest you can ship?
G: I'm actually making a PO run tomorrow on my way to work. So if you send payment before I leave tomorrow (around 10:00AM), then I should be able to drop it off.
KS: Ok I can pay now. Is there still time?
G: Yup. And thanks.
KS: Ok done. Address on Paypal is accurate.
G: Got it. Will PM with tracking in a couple of hours.
KS: Oh man I am hyped. Thanks so much.
G: Dropped off the package at the PO at about 11:30AM.
Postage came out to $43.30 instead of $51.80. I estimated the weight correctly, but the dimensions were different. The length/width/height were in between whole inches. I rounded up and the USPS rounded down, so the USPS still charged an oversized rate, but not as much as I expected.
The difference is $8.40. I wanted to send that to you as a gift payment, but I don't have an email/PayPal ID for you. If you give me that, I'll remit payment to you.
Thanks!
KS: I appreciate you being honest about the discrepancy.
G: Refund sent to you. If there any issues, please LMK. Thanks!
G: Sent an additional $0.10. Typo on my part regarding the refund. Should have been $8.50, not $8.40.
KS: Yea I noticed but wasn't going to say anything about 10 cent. Appreciate you being on top of it regardless.
KS: Just unboxed. Item is certainly not in new, mint condition as there are paint chips and scratches throughout. Inner elbow, back hip skirt, and back just at a quick glance here.
KS: Scuff on front of leg as well. This is pretty bogus, dude.
G: Kuma--
I'm sorry you're disappointed. As I said, if you're not happy, I'll do what I can to make to it right, including letting you send it back for a refund.
I'm not a liar, and I don't like the implication of that. I have never played with that robot. I took it out of the box made sure it was okay, and put it back. This was my extra copy. This thing came from Amazon Japan. I literally had it for two days before shipping it out to you.
I have those lines on the back of my copy, too. Most of those lines are symmetrical, for one thing. I'm not sure what they are, but I noticed them on my copy as well, so I just assumed it was normal. There are other people who have copies here and on Robot-Japan, and if you don't trust me, you can ask others for pictures of the backs of their robots. In fact, it'd be great if you did, because I would be surprised if they didn't have them and because we'd know what was up.
Regarding those minor scuffs...as I said, if there are things I've overlooked, okay, fine. But most toys I have--even brand new ones--have some kind of paint imperfection. And I honestly didn't realize you were going to require absolute perfection. So I'm frankly a bit surprised that you're going over after every minor paint imperfection.
Coming from the world of MPs (I don't have a single MP that doesn't have some type of paint flaw) and even SOCs (my reissue Voltron came with a tiny waist scuff right out of the box, and my original Voltron had scratches right out of the box), I figured there'd be some leeway with that.
You tend to come in hot, so I'm not--emphasis NOT--trying to start an argument. Just trying to explain where I'm coming from, as far as dealing with QC vs. how you deal with it. I wasn't intentionally misleading you. I'm just saying...maybe we have two opinions on what acceptable QC is. In my opinion, those things are pretty minor, compared to what I've seen on my other new toys from other lines. But that's just my perspective, not yours, obviously, and your opinion is the one at issue.
If you want a refund, I'll cover the item and return shipping cost. But you requested expedited shipping at a premium, so I'm gonna ask you to at least help me cover the premium part of that cost.
Please LMK what you'd like to do.
KS: I'm not being hot or displaying any sort of emotion one way or another. I am being straightforward with you and conducting business as such. There's no argument to be had and even reading back I'm not seeing anything besides a basic report of what was seen upon unboxing.
If you're ok with these scuffs then let's switch out the base bodies and if not a return/refund is fine but I'll just put in the claim through paypal to do it proper since they cover the costs of return shipping as well.
G: Put a claim in through PayPal. Send it back. Knowing what I know now. I can't guarantee that there isn't something on the other copy that'll bother you. Plus I've already lost enough money on shipping just on this transaction.
G: "This is pretty bogus, dude" is not straightforward. Nor the implication that I lied to you ("not a new toy").
KS: That's equivalent to saying you can't look over a piece and see that the paint's ok. Go ahead and accept it on there and I'll get your packaging video and this out tomorrow. I'm at work now so can't do all of that now, unfortunately.
For the record; the back scratches aren't huge since it's a backpack piece but the paint chips and the finish scuff in particular I can't get around. How does that even happen in the box?
Anyways, thanks for the fast responses. "That's bogus" - the only way that could have been any more straightforward is having written "That is bogus" so I don't even know where that came from but it isn't my concern atm.
G: I looked over it, and obviously, your standards are much stricter than mine. [See my last comment below]
Or, a calm, polite way would have been, "I'm not happy with this. Sorry for the misunderstanding...etc. etc." It's a tone thing. When you come right out of this gate and say, "This isn't a new toy...this is BS." How do you think that comes off to the other person? And it's not like I'm getting away with anything, because I'm going to lose close to $100 on shipping alone for this deal.
Come on, Kuma. You and I have been around as collectors. You've *never* seen scratches/paint imperfections in a modern toy? Fewture/Artstorm was heavily criticized for its frequent paint slop. TT MPs, etc. You're talking like perfection is the norm...when it isn't.
Those lines on the back are noticeable, yes. But again, I'm not even sure if just occurred naturally from the manufacturing process or not. I'm going to check with some others on that now.
I'm not trying to change your mind on anything. But obviously, we just have two standards, and that's just how it is.
I've sold here and on eBay since 2000. I've never had an item sent back to me. Not for any reason.
KS: Hey you know what? You're right. I understand where you're coming from and even though I didn't mean to call you a liar I can certainly understand how you read it. I actually feel the opposite and appreciate you going above and beyond to be accomodating with communication and shipping.
Yea, I'm admittedly pretty anal mostly because I'm a photographer and my camera picks up EVERYTHING but I have a lot of stuff from this lines parent company Art Storm and looking over the years there are a decent amount of scrapes and scuffs I've gotten new out of the box. Your remark about MPs and stuff made me think of that.
I don't like taking money out of someone's pocket unless it's something huge or deceitful and I don't think this warrants all of that at all. Again my apologies for making you feel as if I think you were lying or something because that makes me feel like sh*t.
G: Thank you. I appreciate that. That's what I was trying to explain, and why I was so insistent on trying to get you to understand. We're both regulars here. We've both been around. If I was intentionally trying to cheat someone, I risk losing my reputation in addition to money, and my reputation is more important than the money.
And yeah, over the years, I've become kind of used to just seeing random slight pain slop, especially as the manufacturing standards aren't that high, even on toys that cost a lot. I mean, every single MP I have has some kind of thing. I just opened my Maketoys Gundog (brand new), and the yellow bands on its arms are both scratched heavily.
If you're open to it, I'll send you $100 as a partial refund (gift payment), and you can keep it. But if you want, you can also send it back and I'll make you whole on this.
I'm also asking some people on the RJ boards regarding the lines on the back.
KS: A partial refund is more than fine amd I appreciate you even offering that. No, I don't want to return, man. It's not even worth the hassle. You're good people and like I said I'm not in this to take money out of pockets.
I bet the back thing is pretty normal between fit testing the backpacks and laying the figures down on whatever conveyor belts and tables while putting them together.
When I get a chance to sit down I'll leave you feedback as well on here and RJ. I really appreciate you communicating so effectively because it honestly helped lead to a very quick moment of clarity.
G: $100 sent back to you.
KS: Feedback left on both [TFW2005 and Robot-Japan].
G: I contacted _______ regarding the lines on the back. He had posted a number of pictures of this toy. I showed him the picture you sent me, and this is what he had to say..."Yes, mine has the lines on the back. They're super slight too and I honestly did not notice them until you messaged me and inspected it under bright light."
I invite you to ask him as well if you want to check.
I wanted to let you know for two reasons:
1) As a fellow collector, I don't want you to be constantly wondering whether something's wrong with your copy of the toy, or whether it's normal. I hate that feeling of not knowing and I want to give you that reassurance. Now we know...my copy has those exact lines, your copy has them, and ________'s copy has them as well.
As far as the small scuffs on the arm and the back areas, to be honest, I had a hard time seeing them even with the close-up pics you sent me. It took a while, and when I noticed, it didn't seem that big a deal. To the naked eye, at a normal distance in normal lighting, they'd be really hard to see and that's why I missed them. As we already discussed, the QC issues you're pointing out are nowhere near what we normally see from Art Storm/Takara/Bandai/etc. But you admitted that and I appreciate it. From your recent pics on the boards, it seems like you're enjoying the toy immensely. That's great.
2) But if I'm being honest, this deal doesn't sit right with me at all, the way it ended. That's because I ended up taking a $100 loss on a toy that was, overall, in new condition and clean and what I told you it would be. I overreacted, too, to the pressure I was getting in the messages from you. I'm very upfront in my transactions, and it hurt, especially after doing my best to fulfill every aspect of this deal, to get sent the messages I got. So I offered a huge partial refund for a couple minor factory scuffs that collectors like me and ___________ wouldn't even bother with.
There are some scumbags out there. But there are also a number of us regulars who just want to get along and not get hurt by these deals either.
In any case, I'll leave it at that.
KS: I don't really understand why this is being dragged? I'm literally in a facebook chat with the person you know as ______ as well as others I followed up with and even told you multiple messages ago that it wasn't huge? Now you're messaging me after I left feedback (which wasn't reciporicated; fine) with this stuff. Needless to say it's kind of odd? You're also leaving out him stating that his doesn't have the paint chips, scuffs, and bubbling throughout.
I didn't ask for a partial refund and in fact I asked just to swap the main bodies which you turned down leading me to believe that the paint whatevers you're calling minor weren't up to your standard either (which I don't blame you for.) With the entire situation, all I said was its fine and I apologize for making you feel like you were being called a liar and I was done. I didn't ask for a THING. The plan was to just keep my preorder for February and if the imperfections bugged me enough I'd just display that and keep this in box for trade fodder or something later.
So to see this after I for the sake of keeping the peace took the high road and accepted something you offered bothers me and seems argumentative. Personally I'm just going to leave the conversation and turn off receipt if future messages to refrain from potentially getting offended. It's not a knock but I'm not going to let this become what it seems to be. I'm not you and I'm not ________ and I'm not going to feel bad or be shamed for being off put by that stuff that as said above you guys have held your own copies to a higher standard than.
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Post by KumaStyle.com (TJ) on Jan 30, 2020 17:06:26 GMT -5
First off, please post screenshots of the entirety of the conversation for the sake of accountability and records as I don't take libel lightly. I'm still waiting on those. Now trying to parse this and if I miss anything lmk. I'm just going to bold your words and respond normally. Glaring, huh? If that's your opinion, okay. You're entitled to your perspective. However, why, after receiving the partial refund, did you go on to post on TFW2005 that the toy I sent you was "top to bottom quality in terms of build and presentation," that "it took you a WHOLE 30 seconds to know that Goshogun is incredible," and, "that the paint job is pretty immaculate" (in your video review)? Why towards the end of our conversation did you acknowledge "a moment of clarity" regarding these minor factory issues? Why did you give me props for sending you a "hot piece" quickly, and then delete said props after I privately called you out?- Because after you went ahead, gave a partial refund, and seemingly were apologetic about it coming in said condition I decided to be positive in feedback because people make mistakes. Are you pretending that you weren't sent pictures of chips, scuffs, amd scratches throughout the figure? Because if so I can easily upload those pictures here as well and it's fairly blatant that you're lying by insinuating that due to you offering a return/refund. Why would you do that if nothing was wrong especially after you were told I'd suck it up? You don't even make sense. - I removed said feedback after you later PMd me with the lies about feeling pressured about said refund. I don't mind glossing over things because someone made a mistake but I'll be damned if I do it for a liar and general asshole. The first statement is lie. I never stated my copy wasn't like yours. You mentioned a number of lines on the back of the robot, and I said, "I have those lines on the back of my copy, too...regarding [your] minor scuffs...as I said, if there are things I've overlooked, okay, fine. But most toys I have--even brand new ones--have some kind of paint imperfection."
When you asked to exchange your copy for mine, I said, "I can't guarantee that there isn't something on my copy that'll bother you," since you were already nitpicking the heck out of the copy I sent you, and I didn't want to risk spending more money on shipping another copy just to get the same response. Also, somebody had inquired about buying my remaining copy--which I did eventually sell--and I was already thinking about selling it while talking to you.- I'm just going to respond to this bullsh*t word salad simply. You can gaurantee it's better by looking over the figure and seeing if it had the same sort of discrepancies in the pictures sent to you of mine. Nothing subjective to it. So you didn't trust me enough to return it? Again, not true, or at least that's not what you told me. I offered you BOTH the option of a partial refund AND returning the toy to me at my own cost. And here was your actual response: "No, I don't want to return, man. It's not even worth the hassle. You're good people and like I said I'm not in this to take money out of pockets."- You're out of your ever loving mind if you expect someone to return a product to you while you have the person's money as well without any sort of security. It's one thing if you're close friends and have that sort of established trust but relative strangers doing a $400 transaction? I'm not even going to justify that sentiment there. I do business like business and even though I'm pretty thorough with sales and have yet to return anything I'd have the buyer do it through Paypal as well. (Btw iirc you offered to split the cost of return shipping and not cover it; didn't matter regardless.) For whatever reason?" Seriously? You think I go around offering $100 partial refunds after every deal? You completely forgot how much hell you raised over PM regarding the "defects" with this toy that you now love so much? Personally, I thought you were hyping up problems with the toy, which, based on all your subsequent reviews, you were. However, I didn't want to end on a sour note, especially as we're both collectors. This is what I offered you: "If you're open to it, I'll send you $100 as a partial refund (gift payment), and you can keep it. But if you want, you can also send it back and I'll make you whole on this."- How is sending you pictures, going along with your offer for a return/refund and then just saying f**k it whatever "raising hell?" There's a very clear and distinct separation between reality and what you're relaying whether it be because of misunderstanding or purposeful twisting for the sake of agenda. So your main point is that to fully prove my innocence, I should have offered to exchange my copy, which you believe was better based on NO evidence, after I already offered to let your return your copy or to give you a partial refund for it. I never told you that my copy was better. I told you that the copy I sent you was originally intended as a back-up copy for my display copy, that I inspected it to make sure nothing was missing or broken or otherwise wrong, and that I was selling because it was too expensive to keep as a back-up. I said the paint looked good to me, and it did (to my eyes, not to my camera's view on close-up under bright lights).
No, I did not take ultra-close-up shots of the inside of the elbow under bright lighting for the sake of finding errors--as you did--so if I missed things, then I was willing to make right on them.
In my own defense, though, you said this, "Yea, I'm admittedly pretty anal mostly because I'm a photographer and my camera picks up EVERYTHING but I have a lot of stuff from this lines parent company Art Storm and looking over the years there are a decent amount of scrapes and scuffs I've gotten new out of the box."
As for the "other collector," I asked if his copy had the lines on the back that you were complaining about and he said it did, just as my copy did. He did not corroborate anything else, as I did not ask about other things, but if I gave the impression that he had, then I was wrong, and I apologize to him for that.- Innocence from what? What are you talking about? I'm not grilling you and haven't bothered you since you tried to make a dramatic mess of a conversation elsewhere. If your copy had the chips, scrapes, and scuffs through the elbow legs, and back skirts you would've said yours had them too (and not just the scratches on the back whoch you seem to focus on leaving out all of the rest. - And you are hitting on the point above with the tail end of your statement here. You ignored the issues pointed put throughout thrlr figure and cherry picked one area that seemed fairly universal to bring to someone I consider a good friend and had already shown the issues in their entirety to which he confirmed his did not share (as well as others. I'll screenshot convos and add them in after posting this.) You then used that to give faux credence to your position that I frankly shouldn't have cared about the entirety of the issues. That's bullsh*t and disingenuous. Again, not entirely true. In your last message, you wrote, "I'm just going to leave the conversation and turn off receipt of future messages." (this basically means that you selected the option to not receive future messages from me. TFW2005 notifed me that you had "permanently left the conversation." If I'm wrong on this, then feel free to correct me.- Leaving a conversation on there means just that; it exits that conversation and you can opt out of receiving more messages from THAT CONVERSATION. If you wanted to start a new conversation with me a second later you could have. The site does not even have an actual block feature. You are absolutely wrong. Your suspicion that I somehow intentionally sold you a copy inferior to my own is just based on your own fears. I can't disprove them anymore than I can stop someone from being paranoid. I told you what I told you, and you can believe or doubt me. But I never gave you cause to think I was trying to cheat you of anything. Regarding why I chose not to spend more money to gamble exchanging copies with a hyper-obsessive and prickly collector with a zoom lens and harsh lighting, I addressed that above. - I never said that and frankly it doesn't matter what the intention was because the result in however it came about was me paying x amount of dollars for something in condition that isn't new/mint as described and that's it. You keep pressing this non-existent image of you being called this or called that when none of the above was done. You were messaged simply, given a description and pics of what was wrong, and no attitude or harsh, personal remarks were made. Cut the sh*t with that as it's tired. You said even before shipping it that you stood by the product. If I'd gotten this from a retailer I'd have returned and tried tp exchange it just the same. It's almost like you have remorse over making right something that came not as described and are trying to publically shame me for it. Nah; I'm not having that. EVER. On my end, call it prickly or whatever you want but I'm someone who takes pride in kerping his items pristine and listing anything big or small wrong with them. Other members canattest to me even videotaping every packaging where I go over the contents top to bottom so that they know they're getting exactly what's describe. I don't expect THAT from.everyone I buy from but I damned sure think that expecting things like blatant paint damage and the like to be put out there prior to purchase isn't being too crazy. I really don't have anything to say on the copy and pasted discussion because it falls right in line with what I said above. Edit: I made a Google folder with the pics I'd initially sent the seller as well as the conversation that I had with the mutual party where he said he didn't share the same issues. For anyone wondering, bubbling paint is a big deal (not to be confused with extra thick/""gloppy" paint areas.) Reason being is that the paint has lost adherence to the product or project and is basically a thin, ticking time bomb waiting to pop and leave the area underneath exposed. Unfortunately since the area around the hole is left with loose edges in terms of the paint it will begin to peel away in general since air and even things like heat and moisture can get in between the paint and product loosening it. This goes for a car, a house, anything. If you get something that comes like this, return it asap and if it's outside of that time and the bubbles eventually pop, paint over it to keep the adherence of what's left. drive.google.com/folderview?id=1MXaT3AAoL6D4FgNK369-ag2n9shef_7Z
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Post by gingaio on Jan 30, 2020 17:37:16 GMT -5
First off, please post screenshots of the entirety of the conversation for the sake of accountability and records as I don't take libel lightly... That was the entirety of the conversation that you asked for, and you know it. Where did I misquote you? What vital piece of info did I leave out or alter from our original conversation?
Libel? Uh, okay, dude. I'm shivering here. What exactly did I say that was libelous? I pointed out the difference between your public statements about the toy vs private complaints to me, and you still haven't explained the discrepancy in a way that makes sense to me. You're the one calling me "shady AF" after I gave you $100 for a toy that I thought you were disappointed in, but that you apparently think is marvelous in your various reviews. But by all means, if you think you have a case, bring it.
I never denied you your right to make a huge deal out of those supposed paint imperfections. As I explained to you in our original conversation, even my reissue SOC Voltron, one of the best QC'ed toys in my collection, has imperfections. My complaint is with the seeming inconsistency in your estimation of this toy, privately vs. publicly, and before and after I gave you a rather large sum of money.
Here's one of the last things you wrote me: "I don't like taking money out of someone's pocket unless it's something huge or deceitful and I don't think this warrants all of that at all. Again my apologies for making you feel as if I think you were lying or something because that makes me feel like sh*t."
In your own opinion, these supposed problems you discovered were *not* "huge" and our deal did not warrant your taking money from me. Yet you ended up more than willing to take a $100 discount from me. Why?
And this oddness in your behavior was a pattern throughout the deal. I shipped this toy out to you within an hour or two of payment. I did that to you as a favor. However, in your PayPal payment note to me--easily the most insulting PayPal note I've ever seen in my life--you actually stipulated that I must ship to you on the same day of payment, even after I promised you twice that I would because you wouldn't stop PMing me the morning of. This isn't just being professional and business-like. This is being, IMO, tone-deaf and antagonistic to someone who is already going out of his way to do you a solid.
But apparently, I don't need to post screenshots because... I really don't have anything to say on the copy and pasted discussion because it falls right in line with what I said above. I don't have anything else to add, either, as this is turning into an insult-fest with you, as it normally does when you lose your temper (pasted below for posterity). I'll leave it at that and I'll let our original conversation speak for itself. First off, please post screenshots of the entirety of the conversation for the sake of accountability and records as I don't take libel lightly. I'm still waiting on those. Now trying to parse this and if I miss anything lmk. I'm just going to bold your words and respond normally. Glaring, huh? If that's your opinion, okay. You're entitled to your perspective. However, why, after receiving the partial refund, did you go on to post on TFW2005 that the toy I sent you was "top to bottom quality in terms of build and presentation," that "it took you a WHOLE 30 seconds to know that Goshogun is incredible," and, "that the paint job is pretty immaculate" (in your video review)? Why towards the end of our conversation did you acknowledge "a moment of clarity" regarding these minor factory issues? Why did you give me props for sending you a "hot piece" quickly, and then delete said props after I privately called you out?- Because after you went ahead, gave a partial refund, and seemingly were apologetic about it coming in said condition I decided to be positive in feedback because people make mistakes. Are you pretending that you weren't sent pictures of chips, scuffs, amd scratches throughout the figure? Because if so I can easily upload those pictures here as well and it's fairly blatant that you're lying by insinuating that due to you offering a return/refund. Why would you do that if nothing was wrong especially after you were told I'd suck it up? You don't even make sense. - I removed said feedback after you later PMd me with the lies about feeling pressured about said refund. I don't mind glossing over things because someone made a mistake but I'll be damned if I do it for a liar and general asshole. The first statement is lie. I never stated my copy wasn't like yours. You mentioned a number of lines on the back of the robot, and I said, "I have those lines on the back of my copy, too...regarding [your] minor scuffs...as I said, if there are things I've overlooked, okay, fine. But most toys I have--even brand new ones--have some kind of paint imperfection."
When you asked to exchange your copy for mine, I said, "I can't guarantee that there isn't something on my copy that'll bother you," since you were already nitpicking the heck out of the copy I sent you, and I didn't want to risk spending more money on shipping another copy just to get the same response. Also, somebody had inquired about buying my remaining copy--which I did eventually sell--and I was already thinking about selling it while talking to you.- I'm just going to respond to this bullsh*t word salad simply. You can gaurantee it's better by looking over the figure and seeing if it had the same sort of discrepancies in the pictures sent to you of mine. Nothing subjective to it. So you didn't trust me enough to return it? Again, not true, or at least that's not what you told me. I offered you BOTH the option of a partial refund AND returning the toy to me at my own cost. And here was your actual response: "No, I don't want to return, man. It's not even worth the hassle. You're good people and like I said I'm not in this to take money out of pockets."- You're out of your ever loving mind if you expect someone to return a product to you while you have the person's money as well without any sort of security. It's one thing if you're close friends and have that sort of established trust but relative strangers doing a $400 transaction? I'm not even going to justify that sentiment there. I do business like business and even though I'm pretty thorough with sales and have yet to return anything I'd have the buyer do it through Paypal as well. (Btw iirc you offered to split the cost of return shipping and not cover it; didn't matter regardless.) For whatever reason?" Seriously? You think I go around offering $100 partial refunds after every deal? You completely forgot how much hell you raised over PM regarding the "defects" with this toy that you now love so much? Personally, I thought you were hyping up problems with the toy, which, based on all your subsequent reviews, you were. However, I didn't want to end on a sour note, especially as we're both collectors. This is what I offered you: "If you're open to it, I'll send you $100 as a partial refund (gift payment), and you can keep it. But if you want, you can also send it back and I'll make you whole on this."- How is sending you pictures, going along with your offer for a return/refund and then just saying f**k it whatever "raising hell?" There's a very clear and distinct separation between reality and what you're relaying whether it be because of misunderstanding or purposeful twisting for the sake of agenda. So your main point is that to fully prove my innocence, I should have offered to exchange my copy, which you believe was better based on NO evidence, after I already offered to let your return your copy or to give you a partial refund for it. I never told you that my copy was better. I told you that the copy I sent you was originally intended as a back-up copy for my display copy, that I inspected it to make sure nothing was missing or broken or otherwise wrong, and that I was selling because it was too expensive to keep as a back-up. I said the paint looked good to me, and it did (to my eyes, not to my camera's view on close-up under bright lights).
No, I did not take ultra-close-up shots of the inside of the elbow under bright lighting for the sake of finding errors--as you did--so if I missed things, then I was willing to make right on them.
In my own defense, though, you said this, "Yea, I'm admittedly pretty anal mostly because I'm a photographer and my camera picks up EVERYTHING but I have a lot of stuff from this lines parent company Art Storm and looking over the years there are a decent amount of scrapes and scuffs I've gotten new out of the box."
As for the "other collector," I asked if his copy had the lines on the back that you were complaining about and he said it did, just as my copy did. He did not corroborate anything else, as I did not ask about other things, but if I gave the impression that he had, then I was wrong, and I apologize to him for that.- Innocence from what? What are you talking about? I'm not grilling you and haven't bothered you since you tried to make a dramatic mess of a conversation elsewhere. If your copy had the chips, scrapes, and scuffs through the elbow legs, and back skirts you would've said yours had them too (and not just the scratches on the back whoch you seem to focus on leaving out all of the rest. - And you are hitting on the point above with the tail end of your statement here. You ignored the issues pointed put throughout thrlr figure and cherry picked one area that seemed fairly universal to bring to someone I consider a good friend and had already shown the issues in their entirety to which he confirmed his did not share (as well as others. I'll screenshot convos and add them in after posting this.) You then used that to give faux credence to your position that I frankly shouldn't have cared about the entirety of the issues. That's bullsh*t and disingenuous. Again, not entirely true. In your last message, you wrote, "I'm just going to leave the conversation and turn off receipt of future messages." (this basically means that you selected the option to not receive future messages from me. TFW2005 notifed me that you had "permanently left the conversation." If I'm wrong on this, then feel free to correct me.- Leaving a conversation on there means just that; it exits that conversation and you can opt out of receiving more messages from THAT CONVERSATION. If you wanted to start a new conversation with me a second later you could have. The site does not even have an actual block feature. You are absolutely wrong. Your suspicion that I somehow intentionally sold you a copy inferior to my own is just based on your own fears. I can't disprove them anymore than I can stop someone from being paranoid. I told you what I told you, and you can believe or doubt me. But I never gave you cause to think I was trying to cheat you of anything. Regarding why I chose not to spend more money to gamble exchanging copies with a hyper-obsessive and prickly collector with a zoom lens and harsh lighting, I addressed that above. - I never said that and frankly it doesn't matter what the intention was because the result in however it came about was me paying x amount of dollars for something in condition that isn't new/mint as described and that's it. You keep pressing this non-existent image of you being called this or called that when none of the above was done. You were messaged simply, given a description and pics of what was wrong, and no attitude or harsh, personal remarks were made. Cut the sh*t with that as it's tired. You said even before shipping it that you stood by the product. If I'd gotten this from a retailer I'd have returned and tried tp exchange it just the same. It's almost like you have remorse over making right something that came not as described and are trying to publically shame me for it. Nah; I'm not having that. EVER. On my end, call it prickly or whatever you want but I'm someone who takes pride in kerping his items pristine and listing anything big or small wrong with them. Other members canattest to me even videotaping every packaging where I go over the contents top to bottom so that they know they're getting exactly what's describe. I don't expect THAT from.everyone I buy from but I damned sure think that expecting things like blatant paint damage and the like to be put out there prior to purchase isn't being too crazy. I really don't have anything to say on the copy and pasted discussion because it falls right in line with what I said above.
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Post by KumaStyle.com (TJ) on Jan 30, 2020 17:52:52 GMT -5
That was the entirety of the conversation that you asked for, and you know it.
Libel? Uh, okay, dude. I'm shivering here. What exactly did I say that was libelous? I pointed out the difference between your public statements about the toy vs private complaints to me. You're the one calling me "shady AF." But by all means, if you think you have a case, bring it.
But apparently, I don't need to post screenshots because...
- No, I don't know it. Not having the entirety of the conversation on hand how would I? And btw leaving a conversation on there automatically deletes it. There was no "me deleting it."
- Yes I called you shady stated absolutely why. You don't have a single thing that retorts said reasons besides some odd remark about shivering (which I'm assuming is from more imaginary pressure.)
- The public statements about the toy vs private complaints has now been explained multiple times. Where is your confusion anymore as to the differences? Did you think the issues disappeared or did you yet again twist things to fit an agenda (see; libel.)
- Why mention a conversation, say you have it, and then give pushback when asked to post actual screenshots of it in its entirety? It seemed like something you were ready to do when you brought it up. I'm asking you again to please do so and thank you.
I don't have anything else to add. I'll leave it at that.
Considering everything stated was factual and backed by what you copied, pasted and admitted you really don't have a choice. Stop selling screwed up stuff.
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Post by nathans82 on Jan 30, 2020 23:28:36 GMT -5
We all have different levels of acceptable defects when purchasing collectibles. But this sounds like there was issues that were not identified prior to selling the items. I've been selling for over 20 years, and always identify if there are issues with the items and offer to take more pictures if the buyer wants them. If the buyer isn't happy with the item (regardless if it's Factory QC, Paint, or other defects) then it's our responsibility as the seller to make it right. It is no different when you buy something from a bigger store (BBTS, TFSource, Amazon, etc..) and have an issue. You send it back to them, and they either replace the item or refund you. Always take responsibility, be accountable, and honest.
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Post by KumaStyle.com (TJ) on Jan 31, 2020 0:25:58 GMT -5
Thank you for the perspective nathans82I'm going to say this and I'm tagging gingaio for the sake of transparency because even though I was messaged you bringing this drama here to avoid TFW's rule about discussing PMs and then apparently went back there and linked to this thread which I'm assuming was for sympathy or something; don't know or care. Whatever you say in response can also be the last word because I'm through. In the end I would have rather you just been straight out when messaged with the pictures and said "f**k you. Those aren't what I feel are worth complaining about" than this roundabout bullsh*t which sent the exact same message. Between the PMs themselves and this here nonsense I feel like I've interacted with multiple personalities going back and forth. You're called a liar when you weren't. You're pressured into something when you weren't. You're ok with a return. You're not ok with a return. You offer a partial refund. You don't like that you gave the refund. It's all just weird sh*t and made a very simple transaction a lot more stupid than it needed to be and you went above and beyond to make yourself look dramatic as hell to deal with in the process. To the point where you were so bugged that I left interacting with you in a professional manner to begin drama on a whooooole other forum. And then there's the whole taking one issue (the back) and selling it to people as if that was the only thing wrong. Just a lot of blatant dishonesty as previously stated. I dunno' man... your motives are yours to know and make decisions by but I feel like this isn't something that turned out as intended. Regardless, let that be it. Don't bug me here or anywhere else. Don't make any passive-aggressive remarks (about me or anyone because if you take an issue you need to be person enough to be direct) and people doing business with him (Predaking000 elsewhere) tread with caution. This could be you dealing with this nonsense. ----------------------------------------------------------------------- As for me, as stated earlier; when it comes to reviews and just general interaction with the community I have to put certain things into priority. Between 10s of thousands of subs on youtube, however many on a facebook fan page, x amount of views on my site I could've shamed this dude in front of a lot of people and literally gotten paid to do it but that's not what I'm about. What's important to me is giving these products spotlight and being as objective and professional as possible in doing so. No one's drama, no bad transaction, no stupid remark gets in the way of that. I honestly do love the mecha genre and having the platform to be able to spread and share with others is a f**king PRIVILEGE that I frankly don't take lightly. I don't know how long I'll be in the hobby but if I can get one person into it, that gets one person into it that gets two people into it.... man my work here is done. It's such a niche are still particularly here in the west that it's crazy. I want that to change... probably won't happen in my lifetime but any piece that any of us can do to help get it on the right path at least gives it the chance to turn around in the future. Sorry about the tangent but it's insane to me that someone would ask why in the f**k I talked about the positives of a high end GoShogun toy done by an upstart company rather than publically droning on about a seller who sold something not as described. Blows my mind. With that, I'm going to get back to talking about GoShogun. -------------------------------------------------------------------- I read something elsewhere about a problem with tabs on the chest but I don't have said issue at least I don't think. I have two tabs at the top of the chest that tab in but don't see anywhere at the bottom to where the poster said it looked like tabs had been clipped off? Edit: He or she was talking about the bottom clips of the backpack. be careful and make sure you have the blue part opened, the upper half of the backpack (the gray portion) pushed up so that the two screws in the middle press in and it lines up cleanly in order for you to press the tabs down.
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Post by gingaio on Jan 31, 2020 1:13:11 GMT -5
We all have different levels of acceptable defects when purchasing collectibles. But this sounds like there was issues that were not identified prior to selling the items. I've been selling for over 20 years, and always identify if there are issues with the items and offer to take more pictures if the buyer wants them. If the buyer isn't happy with the item (regardless if it's Factory QC, Paint, or other defects) then it's our responsibility as the seller to make it right. It is no different when you buy something from a bigger store (BBTS, TFSource, Amazon, etc..) and have an issue. You send it back to them, and they either replace the item or refund you. Always take responsibility, be accountable, and honest. I messaged you privately about this, Nathan, but I figure I'll post it here as well: I just saw your message, and I respect that opinion, but I don't think you understand what happened. I tried to "take responsibility, be accountable, and honest" throughout the deal. That's why I not only offered a large partial refund, but also a full refund/return, *after* he insinuated that I lied about the toy being new, *after* he apologized for that, and *after* acknowledging himself that the QC issues are not unusual or "huge" given the company (this is all in the conversation I pasted). I agree with you that he has a right to be bothered by whatever he's bothered by. I also agree with you that as the seller, I have to take responsibility. Which I did. However, as I stated in my first post on the first page, that wasn't why I brought this up publicly. My issue is that he presented the toy as extremely problematic to me, while on a couple of toy boards (here and TFW2005) and on his YouTube review, he presented it as "immaculate" as far as paint, and of top-notch quality. I mean, how do you explain that? His explanation is that maybe there are better copies out there and he didn't want to misrepresent the toy company or make me look bad, when the function of a reviewer is to report what he sees, and QC issues are not the fault of the seller anyway. Also, he's pointed out problems on toys in reviews before (I don't watch his reviews, but I went back to look at some of his other ones after this happened). Basically, it's ad hoc and utterly BS reasoning. You're right about what sellers should do in general, but I'm not the party that needs to correct his behavior. All due respect, but you're talking to the wrong person and you're on the wrong side of this. Cheers. Thank you for the perspective nathans82I'm going to say this and I'm tagging gingaio for the sake of transparency because even though I was messaged you bringing this drama here to avoid TFW's rule about discussing PMs and then apparently went back there and linked to this thread which I'm assuming was for sympathy or something; don't know or care. Whatever you say in response can also be the last word because I'm through. In the end I would have rather you just been straight out when messaged with the pictures and said "f**k you. Those aren't what I feel are worth complaining about" than this roundabout bullsh*t which sent the exact same message. Between the PMs themselves and this here nonsense I feel like I've interacted with multiple personalities going back and forth. You're called a liar when you weren't. You're pressured into something when you weren't. You're ok with a return. You're not ok with a return. You offer a partial refund. You don't like that you gave the refund. It's all just weird sh*t and made a very simple transaction a lot more stupid than it needed to be and you went above and beyond to make yourself look dramatic as hell to deal with in the process. To the point where you were so bugged that I left interacting with you in a professional manner to begin drama on a whooooole other forum. And then there's the whole taking one issue (the back) and selling it to people as if that was the only thing wrong. Just a lot of blatant dishonesty as previously stated. I dunno' man... your motives are yours to know and make decisions by but I feel like this isn't something that turned out as intended. Regardless, let that be it. Don't bug me here or anywhere else. Don't make any passive-aggressive remarks (about me or anyone because if you take an issue you need to be person enough to be direct) and people doing business with him (Predaking000 elsewhere) tread with caution. This could be you dealing with this nonsense. ----------------------------------------------------------------------- As for me, as stated earlier; when it comes to reviews and just general interaction with the community I have to put certain things into priority. Between 10s of thousands of subs on youtube, however many on a facebook fan page, x amount of views on my site I could've shamed this dude in front of a lot of people and literally gotten paid to do it but that's not what I'm about. What's important to me is giving these products spotlight and being as objective and professional as possible in doing so. No one's drama, no bad transaction, no stupid remark gets in the way of that. I honestly do love the mecha genre and having the platform to be able to spread and share with others is a f**king PRIVILEGE that I frankly don't take lightly. I don't know how long I'll be in the hobby but if I can get one person into it, that gets one person into it that gets two people into it.... man my work here is done. It's such a niche are still particularly here in the west that it's crazy. I want that to change... probably won't happen in my lifetime but any piece that any of us can do to help get it on the right path at least gives it the chance to turn around in the future. Sorry about the tangent but it's insane to me that someone would ask why in the f**k I talked about the positives of a high end GoShogun toy done by an upstart company rather than publically droning on about a seller who sold something not as described. Blows my mind. With that, I'm going to get back to talking about GoShogun. -------------------------------------------------------------------- Well, since I got an email that you "tagged" me back into this conversation... You say that you didn't want to bury me in your review by mentioning the QC defects. But when reviewers review toys, they're not reviewing the retailer. They're reviewing the manufacturer. If Goshogun's QC issues so troubled you, you should have mentioned them because other fans would have more knowledge about the quality of the toy. You weren't protecting me by glossing over any supposed problems--that's the most disingenuous reasoning given in this thread. It's utter BS. As I promised you, I stood by the product and compensated you more than adequately. My hands were clean and if people found out that I looked out for you as a buyer, it would have helped my reputation as a seller. To confront me with all the supposed paint problems that you found, and then to go on YouTube and say that the robot is "pretty immaculate" and to praise Art Storm's "consistent" paint quality (?) Come on, man. Are you just throwing out random words? Are you reviewing a hypothetical perfect copy that you don't actually have? Or are you reviewing your actual copy? I honestly don't know. And I'm sure the people who actually watch your reviews would probably want to know. Speaking of being transparent and direct, my last private message to you, after seeing how you were posting about the toy on the forums, was basically, "Hey, you know what? I'm not really comfortable with how this deal has gone down." At which point you basically told me I was pissing you off, told me that you had "taken the high road" by accepting the refund, and walked away, "leaving" the conversation and blocking future messages on that particular communication chain. Hard to have an honest man-to-man that way.
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Post by KumaStyle.com (TJ) on Jan 31, 2020 1:23:34 GMT -5
When it comes down to it how the deal went down was 100% via your discretion and decision making so you basically messaged me to tell me that you didn't like the decision you made which is outside of my control but I don't mind hearing it. Where it became blatantly offensive was your lying about having been pressured into whatever decisions. I don't owe you or anyone else sitting and giving you a platform to bs me, gingaio; particularly in an offensive manner. I see things as clear as day and there hasn't been one thing you've written that's went unresponded to in a clear and objective fashion. You however don't seem to "get it" and frankly I don't care if you ever do at this point. Look at how you were told that you were never called a liar during that conversation both in it and after yet even in that response you said I apologized for having called you one (I apologized for making you feel that way.) Look at how I said between you and others not having the same issues I felt it unfair to put said issues out there as a one off yet you just said I should've put them out there. You understand that I'd have to put out the caveat that it doesn't seem to be the case woth others which wouldead to questions about where I got it from which leads to having to talk about you, right? If you were done and hands were clean after giving a partial refund then why in the f**k were you bothering me after? Why are you bothering me now? Just leave me alone.
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Post by gingaio on Jan 31, 2020 1:37:54 GMT -5
If you were done and hands were clean after giving a partial refund then why in the f**k were you bothering me after? Why are you bothering me now? I'm not going to address all your points (again), though I'm amazed by your endless ability to paint yourself the victim in this situation. Regarding the two questions above, uh, I was done with this thread. But in your previous response, you said, "I'm going to say this and I'm tagging gingaio for the sake of transparency," which sent me a notification to look at your post in which you told everyone how you could have humiliated me with your mighty YouTube channel and "10s of thousands" of followers "while being paid to do so"...you're such a baller. Thankfully for little old me, you graciously chose not to embarrass me. Just as you graciously chose to protect my good name by not revealing how defective your "immaculate" copy of Goshogun truly was. Also, you practically invited me to come back and say something when you said, "Whatever you say in response can also be the last word because I'm through." And now you're wondering why I responded?
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Post by KumaStyle.com (TJ) on Jan 31, 2020 1:42:03 GMT -5
But regarding these two questions, uh, I was done with this thread. I know... to continue it on another message board. This was also addressed earlier. Goodnight. Goodbye. Be better.
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Post by gingaio on Jan 31, 2020 1:44:31 GMT -5
BTW, Kuma, I found that screenshot of our messages. I'll sell it to you for $100. Free shipping. You cover the PayPal fee, though.
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Post by KumaStyle.com (TJ) on Jan 31, 2020 1:48:54 GMT -5
BTW, Kuma, I found that screenshot of our messages. I'll sell it to you for $100. Free shipping. You cover the PayPal fee, though. Just get one of the people who you said are ok with the defects on this to give me the $393 I paid for it (plus shipping) and you can have $100 from that. ... Oh, no one in their right mind would pay retail for it? Go figure.
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Post by gx9901 on Jan 31, 2020 8:49:38 GMT -5
The last few exchanges here is entertaining and all, but could one of you guys post the pictures of the said paint chips and defects of the actual Goshogun in question? (other than the lines in the back, which was posted somewhere else) I would like to see it in case on the off chance that my Amazon Japan pre-order actually delivers at the end of February, I'd like to know what I might potentially be dealing with. I'm someone that doesn't get too bothered by minor paint defects generally, so I'm curious what the defects discussed in the last few posts actually look like and set my expectations accordingly. Thanks!
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Post by greengetterguy on Jan 31, 2020 10:04:28 GMT -5
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Post by Chen on Jan 31, 2020 10:06:07 GMT -5
I'm not going to delete these posts because both members are being roughly civilized. But going forward any exchange about this topic will be done through PM's.
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Post by FixedInPost on Jan 31, 2020 10:39:33 GMT -5
Wow, this is awful. Seriously considering canceling my pre-order at BBTS.
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Post by KumaStyle.com (TJ) on Jan 31, 2020 10:48:15 GMT -5
I don't want this lady bothering me at all whether it's by pm,carrier pidgeon,smoke signals, etc.. The conversation and transaction were done a week ago and that's half the problem. I'm glad the conversation is not removed. Anyways ref figure; Apparently there's concern over how far the chest should close. Some can get it flush at least temporarily. Mine has a slight gap.
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Post by reVolVer on Jan 31, 2020 11:15:40 GMT -5
Im actually hoping sum1 from POSE+ could read those what has been posted here today hehe.. in regards to thier product.. might help.. (also for the sake of future seller and customer relations )
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