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Post by kencoesta on Feb 11, 2010 16:38:14 GMT -5
I find myself sketching a lot more often (robots, of course), and now I'm looking to pull my sketches into PS and color them. Problem is, I can't seem to paint very well in PS. I'm a graphic professional who lives in PS every single day, I just never ever painted in PS before. So...
I suppose I need a tablet/stylus, right? Seems like all the tutes I've been watching use them and I can't get the results I'm looking for with a mouse (tilted starts and ends). So I need one, yes? Ok, which one?
Wacom Bamboo? Intuos4? There's NO WAY I can affording that thing!
Any other brands?
They seem pretty expensive and I'm a cheapskate (if I can't buy 'em, I'll draw 'em!) - any ideas?
As far as process goes...
1) sketch
2) scan
3) pull into Illustrator
4) Trace (with a tablet)
6) copy and paste into PS as a vector smart object
7) fart with it until desired amount of satisfaction has been achieved.
Also, any links to really go tutes would be appreciated (the robotier, the better).
THANKS!!!
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Post by magengar on Feb 11, 2010 16:47:58 GMT -5
Well, so far, I've heard some raves from Wacom tab users. I wish I had a tab, Period. It would make life easier than drawing with a mouse. Being that it uses a "pen", it will give you better control when drawing lines and such. And if your original artwork were scanned in at a very high resolution (size ratio) you could then tighten up the detail to look more Crispier before reducing the new image back down to size after it's been finalized. As for "vectors" (and "rasters")... I don't know that lingo nor relm, though I've heard of it. To me, an image is an image no matter how I work with it, as long as I can achieve satisfactory results that will Wow the audience I'm ok with it. Good Luck, and keep us posted of your developments and progress.  Late edit: If you're shopping around for a tab, watch for sales at your local electronics store where they'd sell such things. Sometimes you'll find good deals on tabs there. Then, check your local Craigslist in the "Computer" section for folks who're selling tabs dirt-cheap. But it's Hit or Miss when buying at craigslist... ...I lucked in recently on a brand new LCD from a local college student, at a Killer deal of a price. -- but Beware at Craigslist: sometimes what ya see isn't always what ya get. zozo-Magengar |
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Post by xiombarg on Feb 11, 2010 18:11:42 GMT -5
The Intuos4 is a really good tablet. I currently use a Cintiq, which is nice and all but the Intuos worked fine. Never used the bamboo, but I suspect that for the basics it would work fine, especially if you are just getting into it.
Your steps are basically right, but you don't have to use Illustrator if you don't want to. In fact if you've never used Illustrator before I think you would find it fairly frustrating. The results of working with Illustrator vs. Photoshop are completely different, and you really don't use Illustrator as a drawing program. For straight up drawing or painting styles you would want to use PS, although you can get some really tight effects and it's easier to get a more graphic style by using Illustrator with Photoshop.
The basics of getting desired effects with painting/drawing in PS is adjusting the opacity and using the layers pallette, but really there are literally hundreds of tricks to getting desired effects. Oh, and be sure to scan in and keep your DPI at 300 or higher if you ever plan to print or resize your work.
Keep in mind also that learning to use a tablet doesn't just happen overnight either.
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Post by krimpov on Feb 11, 2010 18:15:09 GMT -5
People love to go for the latest model, even if they don't really need it, so if you're cheap just look for the previous version. Sure, the Intuos 4 looks slick, but my "old" Intuos 3 suits me just fine. I don't plan on upgrading anytime soon. (I wouldn't spit on a Cintiq, though... ;D )
The Bamboo is quite cheap, but if it's still too much for you, look for a Graphire 4. Again, its design might not be as slick-looking as the new Bamboo line (which is the continuation of the Graphire), but it works fine. I haven't tried it myself, but it's supposed to be %100 compatible with Vista and Windows 7. (No problem on both with my Intuos 3.)
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Post by kencoesta on Feb 11, 2010 21:03:07 GMT -5
Thanks, guys. magengar - I hadn't thought of craigslist. Don't know why. I just got a kingsize bed for $35 - mattress and all! I'm quite comfortable with vectors and rasters (one's mathematical, the other's pixel) xiombarg - What's the big deal with Intuos? What functions does that have versus Bamboo/Graphire? As far as Illy and Photoshop go, I'm quite comfortable with both. I only added Illy to the production queue (can you tell I'm a project manager?) b/c it was in this last tutorial I watched. I'll add the link at the end of this post. For Photoshop, I'm sure there's a zillion ways to do whatever. I just wanna know a few right now. ^_^ @ krimpov - Why does Cintiq suck? They're all preasure sensitive, right? Some are big, some are little - I guess there's ratio involved. I can't find that tute - I'll post it when I do! Here's a pretty easy one, tho www.photochopz.com/forum/member-photoshop-tutorials/4677-how-paint-robot-simple-photoshop-tutorial.html |
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Post by kencoesta on Feb 11, 2010 23:43:23 GMT -5
www.wacom.com/bamboo/bamboo_pen_touch.phpBamboo Pen and Touch is $100 with 1024 LoP. Says it's for drawing and navigation. My 8 year old Logitech mouse works just fine! www.wacom.com/bamboo/bamboo_pen.phpBamboo Pen seems to be about right. $70 and preasure sensitive (512 Levels of Preasure). Mainly only for drawing, I guess. I could save the $30 and buy a new revoltech! ^_^ I think I'll dork around with painting in PS before dumping the cash, tho.
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Post by xiombarg on Feb 12, 2010 0:04:21 GMT -5
I don't actually know what the differences are between the Bamboo and an Intuos. My guess would be the LoP and I have to say that the button on the side of the Intuos and Cintiq are so freakin handy I don't think I could live without them.
I think Krimpov is saying that he would like a Cintiq (the Cintiq has a monitor right on the drawing pad).
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Post by Kidchuckle on Feb 12, 2010 2:12:22 GMT -5
yeah its the pressure sensitivity.
thats the difference between a bamboo and intuos.
Why does pressure sensitivity really important. You can do different things with it.
such as you can emulate a brush (thick to thin.. great for inking)
- solid to opacity
flat paint to scattered/textured
lots of different settings.
I say this to anyone. If you're going to take painting seriously.. it's better to get what you want long term. Cause these things arn't cheap but it will last you forever!
I had a intuos 2 3X4 it was ok for a little while.
But it was too SMALL!
then I got a intuos 3 9X12 last me a great deal... fun to paint.. but hard to draw
Now I have a cintiq 20' (the 20' is no longer in production...) Expensive but the best decision I ever made.
I can work faster and painting is a breeze... There's no learning curve.
If you ever used a tablet before.. whats weird to get used to.. is painting/drawing with your hand.. but looking at themonitor instead of your hand. Which is really unnatural.. if you're used to drawing or colouring with anything on paper and just looking at where your hand is going (which is most people).
Another alternative i herd is a pc tablet/computer. Although you can't do heavy painting. But kind of portable. I hear the Pressure sensitivity is better these days.
Wacoms are the best brand. I think they've patented it the pen(no batteries needed). Any other brand the pen uses batteries because they can't use that technology.
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Post by krimpov on Feb 12, 2010 8:15:44 GMT -5
@ krimpov - Why does Cintiq suck? I think Krimpov is saying that he would like a Cintiq (the Cintiq has a monitor right on the drawing pad). That. The Cintiq does not suck. Far from that. What I meant to say was that I'm happy with my Intuos 3, that the Intuos 4 looks sweet and all, but that I don't feel the need to burn more money to upgrade to the latest model. Moving to a Cintiq, though, is something I would consider. But I don't feel that I'm at that point yet. |
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Post by kencoesta on Feb 12, 2010 9:14:20 GMT -5
I noticed the patent on the Intuos pen - that's crazy sci-fi right now!
Huh... so i'm guessing there's a HUGE difference between 512 LoP and 1024.
If I got a Bamboo, would I just be unhappy with it?
Pretty sure I'd out grow it quickly?
I farted around with airbrushing in CS4 last night (shperes and cylindars and such) with acceptable results, but not really the style I'm looking for. Guess I just need to be patient and develop.
The functionality I'm looking for is the thick-to-thin inking. Can I get that w/o a tablet?
I appreciate the advice, guys!
Tutes anybody? Links?
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DEROB
Rusty Robot
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Posts: 58
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Post by DEROB on Feb 12, 2010 10:26:35 GMT -5
i'm used in using a mouse before, so when i purchased my first pen tablet, i never used the sensitivity really. Only rely on the opacity settings and brushes.
i'm using a Genius Pen, with zoom scroll feature. And its 3x cheaper than a wacom.
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Post by magengar on Feb 12, 2010 10:49:49 GMT -5
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Post by coldiron on Feb 12, 2010 11:15:47 GMT -5
I am using a Cintiq right now. Its awesome. I do not suggest it for everyone, but it is awesome. I still use an older intuos on my other computer and it work very well too. If you are just coloring, there is a lot that can still be done with a mouse. Though it is very limitied, you can make it work for the time being. Using paths to create your shapes, convert them to marquise and then painting within them will allow you to have more control with your mouse.
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Post by magengar on Feb 12, 2010 11:37:39 GMT -5
Another thing to add to your arsenal: P A T I E N C E I say this because I draw with a mouse, and like Coldiron says, I trace shapes with a mouse and color them in (I use Ulead Photo Express 2.0 for editing my images, whether they're photos or drawings). A lot of times, I lose Patience and end up ruining my drawings and images. If something takes too long to drawn (a shape, a line, or object) Relax and Breathe easy while moving your pen <or mouse> slowly to get that perfect edit done right. For TABS, there are many brands and models to choose from. Just make sure you read about them and their specs so that you can decide which tab will suit your needs. Here's a YouTube link search results listing many Many MANY Pen Tab tutorials here... www.youtube.com/results?search_query=Pen+Tab+tutorials&search_type=&aq=f...get out yer popcorn, it's gonna be a looong matinee at YouTube. ;D zozo-magengar |
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Post by kencoesta on Feb 12, 2010 12:52:53 GMT -5
Totally needing a lot of patience right now! ^_^; So, I'm looking this tute ionen.deviantart.com/art/Photoshop-Painting-Tutorial-76857572I'm following it pretty well, but at Step #4, to me, there's a huge leap between the first and second picture. That's what I need help with. Are we smudging or air brushing, or what? |
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Post by magengar on Feb 12, 2010 14:42:44 GMT -5
Hmmm... I see that big leap between those pics. Looks to me like you might wanna try air-brushing, or whatever air brush tool your program is using. Now, what are you trying to do there, "blend" from a dark shade to a lighter shade? Because this is where the air brush may help. If this is the case, Opacity is the key- just like that tut says. The lighter the opacity will make whatever color you're airbrushing Transparent, while the opposite will make the color more solid. You'll need a color-picking tool to sample the actual color you're blending from... then use that picked color to find the next lighter shade of that color for your blend. Blending from dark colors: you can always brighten to the next lighter shade level. This works well with skin tones where shadows are cast from light sources in the image; like, when a character is stepping out from a dark area in the scene. To me, I look at it as blending from Left to Right to get my brighter shade. If my character were stepping Into a dark area, I'd blend my shades in reverse from Right to Left. I use this technique to help me when I'm drawing on paper, as well as with my computer... it's a weird perspective, but it's my own "math" of doing my artwork. I hope I didn't confuse you. Anyone else who's more technically knowledgeable in this, Please help chime in with suggestions. Thanks! zozo-Magengar Totally needing a lot of patience right now! ^_^; So, I'm looking this tute ionen.deviantart.com/art/Photoshop-Painting-Tutorial-76857572I'm following it pretty well, but at Step #4, to me, there's a huge leap between the first and second picture. That's what I need help with. Are we smudging or air brushing, or what? |
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Post by kencoesta on Feb 12, 2010 15:24:14 GMT -5
Ok, whatcha think of this? Obviously the drawing itself isn't good at all, but mostly I was working on the brushing technique. The ink lines are just horrible. Does that take practice, or are there some brush setting that can make it a bit better? Or both?!? ^_^  |
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Post by xiombarg on Feb 12, 2010 15:55:16 GMT -5
Totally needing a lot of patience right now! ^_^; So, I'm looking this tute ionen.deviantart.com/art/Photoshop-Painting-Tutorial-76857572I'm following it pretty well, but at Step #4, to me, there's a huge leap between the first and second picture. That's what I need help with. Are we smudging or air brushing, or what? Yes, but there is two basic things he's doing here. First he's blending the line breaks from one block of color into the other forming a soft transition. The second thing he's doing looks similar, but it is a separate step really that takes place after softening the block transitions. So next he's adding the subtle lights and shadows. It refines the shapes giving them that extra depth. Ok so why is this different. Mainly because you aren't just softening the big transitions from one color to the other. You'll probably be using a much lighter transparency and doing a lot more small switches from value to value of a single hue (or it can sometimes be from color to color to color..) often doing several if not dozens of sweeps to get those contours where you want them to be. Here's a little tip. When working on a particular step, finish that step for the whole piece before moving into another step, AND keep each step on it's own layer. What I mean is that it's temping sometimes to just finish the face entirely before moving on. Ok, say you decide you don't like the color of your shading step and you want the shadows more blue. If your whole piece is on one layer you have to repaint it, whereas if you have all your shading on a single layer you can just change the color balance on that layer and save yourself astronomical amounts of time. I know this sound pretty basic, but working on piece in one little section at a time instead of working the whole piece step by step is more tempting than you might think. |
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Post by magengar on Feb 12, 2010 16:30:23 GMT -5
@ Xiombarg: Man, you explained it Best, right down to the science of it! True indeed, working on the object in layerssaves a lot of time and work, and reduces headaches.  Thanks!!! @ Kencoesta: You did a good job with those gradients from dark red towards the lighter shades of red; and I like the smooth highlighting (the bright white areas which gives the armor that specular lighting touchup). As for the lines, yeah, they take practice to get them to look well rounded, especially when drawing around the red armor parts there. When you worked on it, was that image in a larger size? Sometimes I've had to enlarge an image anywhere from 500dpi to 1000dpi so that I can draw the lines in just a few inches (or pixels) at a time, following the curves and staying close to the area where the lines will enclose (in this case, the black lines enclosing the red armor). If my lines appeared too thin, I'd thicken them in some areas. When I get the final result, I then reduce the size of the image, and then everything will look fine-detailed and crisp; the curved lines will apppear smoother and well-contoured around the enclosed areas. zozo-magengar |
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Post by kencoesta on Feb 12, 2010 17:13:37 GMT -5
Great Tips, Xiombarg! magengar - Yeah, the psd was in 300dpi. Thanks for the critique - I decided to envision him kinda busted up (to justify the crappy ink lines!) ^_^; *Practice Practice Practice* |
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