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Post by Mark on Apr 12, 2019 19:12:52 GMT -5
Last I checked the Sentinel Ultraman was closer to $500... www.bigbadtoystore.com/Product/VariationDetails/40805I also think you need to reexamine the joints. Those things run on rails and magnets. Definitely not your typical run of the mill double bend held together by two pins. And if you don't think those poses it pulled off on the previous page with such strange joints is not good articulation, I'm not sure what to tell you. Is it expensive? Yep. Overpriced? Nothing too unusual by today's standards *coughmp44cough*. It's a huge, compact figure with lots of strange engineering. Supposedly it's also being made in Japan too by the same factory that makes those $2000 Volks Dollfie figures, so that also factors into the price.
It sounds to me like you're more put off by the design and it being so skinny than anything else factoring into the actual quality of the figure.
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Post by mpchi on Apr 12, 2019 19:23:51 GMT -5
Last I checked the Sentinel Ultraman was closer to $500... www.bigbadtoystore.com/Product/VariationDetails/40805I also think you need to reexamine the joints. Those things run on rails and magnets. Definitely not your typical run of the mill double bend held together by two pins. Is it expensive? Yep. Overpriced? I'm not sure I agree. Never buy those limited releases or web exclusives from BBTS. They jack up the prices of those big time. They are good for other stuff and Hot Toys. Got those Ultramans at $300-$320 shipped (depend on which one) from Sentinel's Gen-tin-nel web store during their releases. Gotta say the rail & magnet joints are cool. Didn't know that until you point it out. Still overpriced IMHO. |
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Post by Mark on Apr 12, 2019 19:44:15 GMT -5
I'll take your word for it because I can't find those Ultraman figures at stock prices since they're all sold out, but generally, when I think of Sentinel prices, I'm talking more about their Dancouga or Gravion- tiny 8-inch figures that ran for roughly $400-$500 a piece. They did have some transformation, but that functioned more like an armor addition gimmick than anything particularly complex.
On topic again- unless my eyes are deceiving me, all those chalky frame bits are diecast:
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Post by Magmatron on Apr 13, 2019 3:29:37 GMT -5
I'll take your word for it because I can't find those Ultraman figures at stock prices since they're all sold out, but generally, when I think of Sentinel prices, I'm talking more about their Dancouga or Gravion- tiny 8-inch figures that ran for roughly $400-$500 a piece. They did have some transformation, but that functioned more like an armor addition gimmick than anything particularly complex.
On topic again- unless my eyes are deceiving me, all those chalky frame bits are diecast:
I think only the abdomen is diecst. The chalky colored parts are just a different kind of plastic from the main body, maybe ABS and PVC. |
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Post by KumaStyle.com (TJ) on Apr 13, 2019 9:55:45 GMT -5
Between Volks being pretty small/lowkey, what's likely to be an extremely small production run, this thing's size/engineering, and the fact that it's such a niche robot the pricing sadly makes some sense. It's gorgeous but that's a hefty msrp.
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Post by Mark on Apr 13, 2019 13:58:49 GMT -5
I think only the abdomen is diecst. The chalky colored parts are just a different kind of plastic from the main body, maybe ABS and PVC. Abdomen isn't diecast- it's the same glossy plastic as the hands. The inside has a some metal joints from earlier pictures for it to flex. The chalky bits though look like unpolished metal. Except on the arms, which look more like plastic. But, I'm not 100% sure.
Between Volks being pretty small/lowkey, what's likely to be an extremely small production run, this thing's size/engineering, and the fact that it's such a niche robot the pricing sadly makes some sense. It's gorgeous but that's a hefty msrp. Five Star Stories and by extension Gothicmade are far from niche in Japan- but agreed with pretty much everything else you said. Volks tends to make their products for a boutique market, like those Muv Luv TSF figures. And since they have their own physical stores in Japan and online, they have no problem pricing their products as high as they want, because they are their own distributor. That being said, I still stand by my belief that this price wouldn't be much different from what other non-Bandai companies would have charged had they made this figure.
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Post by KumaStyle.com (TJ) on Apr 13, 2019 16:12:32 GMT -5
I'm not trying to be funny but if you compare it to things like Mazinger, TTGL, etc. it's niche and then breaking it down to those viewers who collect, and then those collectors willing to drop towards $750 USD on a piece from this, you've got a small pool.
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Post by Mark on Apr 13, 2019 17:19:29 GMT -5
I'm not trying to be funny but if you compare it to things like Mazinger, TTGL, etc. it's niche and then breaking it down to those viewers who collect, and then those collectors willing to drop towards $750 USD on a piece from this, you've got a small pool. There have been hundreds of FSS garage kits priced around $500 mark being released year after year for FSS since the 80s... made by industry professionals like Wave, Kaiyodo, Volks, etc. This isn't even the most expensive officially released FSS product- that would have to go to the Jagd Mirage Twin Tower released in the late 90s for $2000- and there were two of them made by different companies. The only other mecha franchise that can only compare in that regard for Garage Kits is Gundam- and most of those are made by 3rd party Korean or Chinese companies, not officially licensed like the FSS ones.
Believe me, this will sell. FSS may be new to the "high-end toy" market, but the price is more than typical of what's been released associated with the series. I daresay, it's cheap compared to buying a pack of resin parts for a statue that cost 2/3 the same amount that you have to put together and paint yourself.
I'm also not sure why you brought up Gurren Lagann because it's a small fry with little in the way of high-end merchandise. I could count all the noteworthy releases with one hand. And it isn't a quarter as popular as FSS in Japan, which was one of the top ten best-selling manga on Amazon.jp and Rakuten in 2018.
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Post by KumaStyle.com (TJ) on Apr 13, 2019 21:14:24 GMT -5
Exactly... garage kits. They're hella' expensive by nature. You're just pushing out these random numbers like I said it was the most expensive piece for the series ever made. I honestly have no idea of what you're responding to with that because it's not my point nor is it anything even written. In fact, what you did though is prove my actual point in that it is in fact a much more niche series than the others aforementioned and thus gets product support made at and on a more low key level. It's not a knock; it's just fact.
This feels like one of those conversations that will go on forever with the main point being ignored so I'm going to let it lay.
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Post by Mark on Apr 13, 2019 21:39:18 GMT -5
Exactly... garage kits. They're hella' expensive by nature. You're just pushing out these random numbers like I said it was the most expensive piece for the series ever made. I honestly have no idea of what you're responding to with that because it's not my point nor is it anything even written. In fact, what you did though is prove my actual point in that it is in fact a much more niche series than the others aforementioned and thus gets product support made at and on a more low key level. It's not a knock; it's just fact. Sorry, but garage kits and high-end collectible gokins are equally "niche products". They're both boutique limited-run items for more hardcore fans that require the user pay a premium to get their hands on, and made in much more limited quantities than something like a plastic model. The reason you and others associate garage kits as being more niche than gokins is because most of the time, GK's are more akin to doujinshi products, being fanmade and not always licensed, being sold exclusively at conventions- none of which have ever applied to FSS models, with many garage kits being easily purchasable on sites like HLJ or Hobbysearch upon their release. What I'm telling you is that your general bias that some series having more garage kits means that it's less popular or more niche isn't a "fact"- it's a nonsensical assumption.
The reason you haven't seen more things like FSS gokins in the past is because its author, Mamoru Nagano, is not a fan of selling his designs as toys- and has personally cancelled many attempts by other companies in the past. It's the same reason things like Ghibli gokins are almost non-existent. It has nothing to do with popularity, and if anything, being released as a Gokin or other high-end figure already puts the product in a certain niche.
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Post by KumaStyle.com (TJ) on Apr 13, 2019 21:45:14 GMT -5
Exactly... garage kits. They're hella' expensive by nature. You're just pushing out these random numbers like I said it was the most expensive piece for the series ever made. I honestly have no idea of what you're responding to with that because it's not my point nor is it anything even written. In fact, what you did though is prove my actual point in that it is in fact a much more niche series than the others aforementioned and thus gets product support made at and on a more low key level. It's not a knock; it's just fact. Sorry, but garage kits and high-end collectible gokins are equally "niche products". They're really not, though. You want to compare a garage kit produced in the hundreds or maybe even a thousand with maybe a single buying option outside of second hand sellers (think; ebay) or to to Things like Soul of Chogokin which are extremely mass-produced and even to the point of have individual distributors per country/region? Man... no. |
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Post by Mark on Apr 13, 2019 22:12:01 GMT -5
They're really not, though. You want to compare a garage kit produced in the hundreds or maybe even a thousand with maybe a single buying option outside of second hand sellers (think; ebay) or to to Things like Soul of Chogokin which are extremely mass-produced and even to the point of have individual distributors per country/region? Man... no. If I wanted to, I could have bought any FSS model I wanted on casual sites like HLJ or Hobbysearch, back when they were being released.
It appears you didn't read my post at all- FSS garage kits are treated and distributed like official products- because they are such. They are not one-convention fan items like what you have in mind when you think of garage kits. You also seem to be confusing international distribution with amount of actual product being made- which as we can all see from the past few years of preordering any Metal Build or Macross Valkyries, isn't the case. Companies dedicated to importing obscure expensive high-end Japanese collectibles weren't even a thing until two decades ago with middlemen like Bluefin and Diamond Comics, and even that had its limitations to certain companies, specifically Bandai. There were no companies dedicated to bringing over CM's or Wave or Aoshima or Good Smile or Yamato products (except maybe Yamato USA, which is cheating since that's their own company), these all had to be imported. Only recently (as in the past decade) has that range expanded. Nowadays FSS GK's are no longer being made, so you don't see them be sold often anymore unless you look for second-hand options, just like any other high-end collectible. Simple as that.
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Post by KumaStyle.com (TJ) on Apr 13, 2019 22:17:17 GMT -5
This feels like one of those conversations that will go on forever with the main point being ignored so I'm going to let it lay. QFT |
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Post by Mark on Apr 13, 2019 22:45:45 GMT -5
To be on topic again, this figure is guaranteed to be a Volks exclusive on all their sites, Japanese or American, because that's how they've been releasing all their products these past few years. They've cut off ties with all middlemen sites and resellers and taken matters into their own hands with their own webshop and physical stores. Bandai is trying to do the same thing with their P-Bandai Webshop, but their distribution range is much smaller than that of Volks'. So regardless of the popularity of FSS, this figure is geared towards a specific niche of collectors just like all other Volks products.
It doesn't look super quality at all, in fact, it looks rather cheap as it uses unpainted white plastics. It looks nothing like the one they showed before. And I doubt it will sell well at all, not because of its price, but these new GTM designs are just not nearly as popular as the classic FSS designs. Are you looking at the unpainted prototype I posted up there? Because its finish in all the other pics look the exact same as the OP.
Also, you're wrong about the popularity of the this design in Japan, having a movie kind of elevates it above most FSS designs now in the public eye. Regardless of whether people like it or not, it's going to sell merely because it's a Volks product, just like their Dollfie line. It has little to do with the popularity of FSS or the design itself.
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Post by KumaStyle.com (TJ) on Apr 13, 2019 22:49:34 GMT -5
It doesn't look super quality at all, in fact, it looks rather cheap as it uses unpainted white plastics. It looks nothing like the one they showed before. And I doubt it will sell well at all, not because of its price, but these new GTM designs are just not nearly as popular as the classic FSS designs. I said it was niche but look what happened. |
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Post by Mark on Apr 13, 2019 22:56:52 GMT -5
Here's what the crowd looked like at the product showcase... niche/unpopular my butt lol
Whether they'll buy it is another matter, but the interest is already there.
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Post by Mark on Apr 13, 2019 23:04:31 GMT -5
I'm talking about the one shown in the video you linked. Do they look the same to you? They do look the same, but they're under different lighting. I know for sure the white is all painted because you already have the unpainted prototype to compare it to with its raw greenish plastic. I'm more confused now about why you're upset- are you just not a fan of more glossy finishes? The OP picture has a slightly more matte look to its white. |
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Post by Mark on Apr 13, 2019 23:29:25 GMT -5
As for the new design being so 'popular', it's been 6 full years since Mamoru Nagano had introduced GTM desgins, but up until now, there had been 'ZERO' GTM products ever made, while the classic FSS MH stuffs were being continuously produced like Volks' own IMS series. That was because Mamoru Nagano placed a ban on all Gothicmade figures from being released until after this one was. He personally worked on designing the figure since 2013 alongside Volks and wanted it to kickstart the new direction of models involving the new designs (that Japanese magazine article on the first page mentions that the Zarathustra Apterbringer and Magnapalace- the new LED and KOG- also have figures under development).
"The ban on all Garage Kit manufacturers will be lifted after the release of Kaiserin".
No, I could not make this up if I tried. The man is extremely controlling and protective of his series and what products get released under his brand name.
The latest artbook featuring more of the new designs sold pretty well from what I've heard, again on sites like Amazon.jp, Rakuten, Yahoo Japan, etc. Even the sites I was looking to buy it from (Ami Ami, HLJ, Hobbysearch, Otaku Mode) were all out of stock until about a couple weeks ago with a second reprint.
And you're right about those eyes, hope that's just the prototype paint being worn out and not something on the final release.
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Post by Mark on Apr 13, 2019 23:55:30 GMT -5
I think the ban is only for the Kaiserin figure as the tweet is about the Gothicmade movie, but we'll see about that. And as for the figure, this unpainted white plastic thingie in a final product is rather common in toy scene. A toy looking absolutely awesome in promo photos ended up looking like a cheap plastic toy in final product. (a recent example would be high metal r Techroide Blader) Anyone who's been collecting toys for while should be able to notice it instantly. No, it's about FSS in general. I only shared that tweet because it was relevant to what I was saying, but in the event Nagano was talking about his overall direction with FSS. Here's some other coverage of the event that mentioend the same thing about the GTM ban being lifted:
Whatever the case, the lack of Gothicmade products being released is solely because Nagano doesn't want them out yet, not because of something like lack of popularity, to which all sources point the opposite. The film is still being requested and played in theaters in Japan, the new manga and artbooks still sell well, etc. Money talks louder than some vocal internet complaints.
Not sure why you keep bringing up the white plastic because that isn't bare plastic. It's fully painted. As I said before, the raw green unpainted prototype from the previous page is what it looks like underneath that paint, and that is from the same event. The missing blue on the eyes is a problem, but once again I hope that's just something forgotten on that test shot.
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Post by Mark on Apr 14, 2019 15:00:17 GMT -5
Product brochure, pics are a bit large:
Lineart accuracy is impressive. As expected from Mamoru Nagano, who would never ever let companies like Sentinel re-stylize his designs in a million years.
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