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Post by magengar on Jul 29, 2012 15:34:23 GMT -5
Excellent. I'm also happy to see you have an understanding for
the work that goes into making those specimens.
Typically, a rubber mold's tear strength can only endure so
much usage that sometimes new molds have to be made.
Even a good rubber mold can have a hidden tear in a weak
or thin area, and can easily be damaged worse if the mold
is handled roughly.
Usually molds develop tear weaknesses with age and then
new molds would have to be made anyway.
So, I guess the guy may have been on some limited budget
and was trying to salvage the mold for as long as it could
still be used until it was time to toss it out.
Expanding foam has a very good advantage that it will prevent
a hollow thin-walled object from sagging.
There are many expanding foam brands on the market strictly
for purposes of this and other similar hobbies, but I haven't
tried them yet because I went the cheapo way and used
the Great Stuff insulation foam instead.
The only brand of expanding foam I'm familiar with (but haven't used)
is produced by Alumilite. I use their mold-making/resin-casting supplies.
Bourno knows the brands of expanding foams and he can
recommend which brand is best to use for your projects.
zozo-mag
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Post by 1oldrobot on Jul 29, 2012 16:32:44 GMT -5
ah, im a sculptor so expanding foams etc are a way of life. thats why i complained about the mazinger z copy i got - i know when to throw away a mold. its a thai maker, which says a lot. i lived in asia for 12 years total, not including australia. 10 years in japan and 2 in thailand. i know the many headed thai bootleg market all too well, and i know how manufacturers will cut corners as much as possible to make something LOOK functional at a great price but..............with a mold that had been patched so many times and should have been discarded long ago, i dont have much sympathy for the guy. he got good feedback from me but no more purchases. to have made another mold to replace a badly torn one would have cost him less than the price of one kit he sells. im pretty ticked, and it shows this particular guy doesnt care about the craft and content very much. just more junk to sell. like in thailand, im sure i can find another seller on ebay that is based right around the corner from him and does a better job.
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Post by magengar on Jul 29, 2012 17:20:59 GMT -5
My bad for overlooking that fact and underestimating you.
If that guy's mold was really That bad, then I must agree with you
don't buy from him and find someone who does a better quality job.
I often forget that for as many good quality bootleggers there are more
than many bad quality sharks out there looking to rip people off with
bad quality booties.
I just hope I get a decently made thai-boot Maz model kit from the
seller in Thailand when the time comes for me to order one.
(it's the Maz kit which RJer Gettershadow bought just recently.)
zozo-mag
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Post by 1oldrobot on Jul 29, 2012 21:38:08 GMT -5
thats the same kit i got. for the most part its nice, but the crotch area is just unacceptable. i patched it with jb kwik, which is not really a great idea because its epoxy, so if i had to sand it there would have been trouble. i patch w it all the time, though, and got it nice and smooth. i use jb kwik because i can mix unevenly and keep it flexible like the vinyl so it doesnt just fall off if the shape changes. you can still make the model look killer, but it will take some work. to the defense of (after my offense) cyber_model, i wrote him yesterday and told him about it. he agreed and said he is awaiting a new mold. he also warned me that the larger models he has are very thin pours and cant support their own weight. i have 2 of those giant models and will need to use expanding foam. he also said the vinyl on the larger ones is also over baked and burnt in spots. he does not cast these and is a reseller. cool guy, dont want to bash his business. this seller seems pretty forthcoming with info so ask him first. sorry to be so cranky this week, but between that damned dairugger (that ive owned 3x and hated it each time) and it trying to kill some other pieces, along with a so-so cast of a VERY COOL mazinger z model, i was mad at all the workarounds. but the dairugger is inexcusable. i dont like a single american jumbo ive ever seen by these cheeseball merchandising companies. ive seen some customs that are just killer, but not the usual suspects doing mattels evil work through the eyes of hamburger eating football watching and ham fisted 'mericans. its like getting texan ranch fence builders to make elegant japanese shoji and byobu. i just never envision myself saying "stomu toruppa vs majingaa!" upside down crosses and inverted pentagrams to mattel and cohorts.
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Post by magengar on Jul 29, 2012 22:27:35 GMT -5
It's experiences such as these that make this hobby exciting.....
The Dairugger trippin out on you now will be a funny story
to tell later on. ;D
I often read Cyber_model's eBay page whenever he has more
of those kits for sale... I like how he explains everything in detail
to describe those kits, he's very honest and up-front about them.
He even goes as far as explaining which areas to trim/cut in order
to assemble the kits.
I've read his feedback page and recognize a couple RJers who
have bought these kits from him, the feedbacks were all positives,
so now I feel safe to go ahead and score a Maz kit.
I feel more inspired by the challenge of doing the work to assemble
the kit in finished form with the tweaking and painting involved.
As for the U.S. side of this toy story, the last time I ever liked any
U.S.-made Japanese robot toy was the Mattel Shogun Warrior
classic jumbos of the '70s along with the jumbo Voltron.
zozo-mag
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Post by 1oldrobot on Jul 29, 2012 23:15:37 GMT -5
im right there with ya. the mattel jumbos started the fire for me and influenced my art for life. i dont really sit around drawing mazinga heads in my free time, but there is a lot of traditional and beautiful form in the original shoguns that compelled me to study a lot of technique and design. mattel dumbed it down, but still, to have even the whole mattel collection is a sight. the primary colors, the size, the stylings as a group is just great. some of them i dont do backflips over individually, but all together, wow! its been 8 months since i started restoring my lost collection and i am mesmerized by these things just like when i was 4. youre right about the US GoLion Voltron. the base is a funny thing, but the robot kicks ass and is a very accurate representation. id love to have one some day.
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Post by lexcars2007 on Jul 31, 2012 8:11:43 GMT -5
For the guy asking about painting Jumbo 's... if your mixing your own paint, they make additives, there is a flexable part additive you can mix with paint ( if you air brush ) it's the same stuff they use when painting bumpers on cars....it makes the paint bond better, and has a less chance of chipping or wearing off at the joints, Also paint does NOT stick to a smooth surface, it must be sanded, but only a very fine grit paper, about 1200 grit in a wet paper....or what I found that works without putting sand scratches in the item is.......a Mr. Clean magic eraser !!!!!! I won't remove scratches in an item, but put super fine abrasions in it so the paint can adhere . Also primer should always be a must, and epoxy base primer and paint sticks the best..I hope this helps....check at your local automotive paint supplier, for materials..and ask them for help. I'm not totally sure, but I think this post got a little off track  I loved all the info, but was you asking about painting jumbo's like Mattel's shogun's or was it a jumbo model ? |
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Post by 1oldrobot on Jul 31, 2012 12:29:28 GMT -5
hmmm, that works for painting PE and PP?
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Post by lexcars2007 on Jul 31, 2012 14:26:41 GMT -5
The DP -90 epoxy primer is a self etching primer, it acually eats in to the material...even metal, but does not soften plastic.... Ask any automotive paint supplier for an etching primer, it is a 3 part primer, the thinner/reducer..the hardener and or flex additive, and the epoxy itself. It can be reduced enough for a airbrush..WARNING paint in a WELL vented area, and clean your airbrush ASAP..or use a junk one, like I do. Also you can always find a PPG web site for info. I hope this helps a little...
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Post by 1oldrobot on Jul 31, 2012 15:14:22 GMT -5
thats why i ask. still not sure ot will work. PE and PP resist pretty much everything, including epoxy. mayb very light sprays of primer will "work" but because PE is a low energy surface, by design, nothing sticks to it. roughing it up w sandpaper is the best bet to paint the PE portions of jumbos, and even then, it is not really a true bond. i posted a while back on a bonding agent for PE that requires the surface to be flame treated, a little much for a paint job. as cheesy as it seems, i use colored duct tape on my art work when i am working with low energy surfaces. i dont really think these can be painted to a durable finish. maybe for display purposes, but not for handling regularly. when i tried out my bonding agent on a PE bucket, i spray painted it after flame treating and the paint did stick. cant scrape it off. ive seen plenty of primers etc that claim "works on low energy surfaces." ive never seen that work and i work with a lot of plastic, but who knows, im sure there is a miracle agent out there somewhere, but the PE will still need to be treated somehow prior to primer etc.
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Post by lexcars2007 on Jul 31, 2012 15:58:53 GMT -5
I understand your reply now...I have worked with automotive plastics, the dash and door panels, and kick panels etc...and with a grain type surface, well sanding dont quite work, I would do a quick wipe down with acetone, so it sticks better. But I did a Jm for my kids, Mazinga, and used a Mr. Clean magic eraser on one shoulder socket, but not the other. The scuffed one has not had the paint come off yet...YET I SAY, but my 2 boys give him quite the work out, I just did his arms , and legs silver, with a touch of rust..I used plastic parts primer, the type you get in a can...3-4 light coats, then 2-3 coats of the silver rustolem . and a dusting of brown paint, for the rusty areas . But I do know that the DP line of automotive primers , are a self etching, they will actually eat into the metal surface, after the paint was sanded off..Maybe it was just because of the sand scratches ? Though like you said, sand..sand...sand. Do we agree on that ? |
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Post by 1oldrobot on Jul 31, 2012 17:24:08 GMT -5
we agree on sanding for sure. auto plastics are cool to work with, i salvage stuff sometimes for prefab shapes and ive had really good luck with dashboards, etc. ill try clean magic eraser and see if it can withstand some durability tests i do to make sure finish etc. is intact after shipping stuff i build. wiping down w acetone is essential. is the magic eraser acetone based by any chance?
ever work with the VHT anodized finish sprays? i love the VHT line of paints and the vinyl dyes are really interesting. dont use their engine paint on jumbos or models, though. a lesson i learned recently.
your method seems to have withstood the most extreme durability test - to let kids play with it. they will always give it a good workout. if it can take that, its probably good enough for collectors.
if you have a test piece, can you run your fingernail through it and let us know if it removes the paint or not? if it is durable enough to withstand that, this could be a really good method.
on a different note, do you have any idea how to make a protective clear coat over unfinished brushed steel?
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Post by lexcars2007 on Jul 31, 2012 20:19:53 GMT -5
WOW tricky question, years ago I use to clear coat alum. tanks and rims for tractors....after washing the tanks in acid, and steel wool, we could paint them and they would last for years. But to put clear on unfinished, brush steel ? Maybe try the acid with steel wool, but only move the way the brushed look goes " normally when I sand, I try to use a circular motion, so I don't get flat spots. Flat areas you can sand back and forth. I can't remember the acid we used back then, but I bet PPG has some info on it. I did the fingernail test, and on the arm I scuffed with the magic eraser, held up...no paint came off, the other arm did, but not real bad. and the shooting hand of mazinga, I had painted black, after scuffing also...I couldnt even put a dent in it. I have a few extra shoulders for the jumbo's, so I just went out and scuffed it till all the gloss was gone, paying great attention to the creases, wiped it down with xylene ( I was out of acetone ) then applied 3 fine coats of Schirwinn williams silver paint. I am also out of any acid primers. And I will see if this holds up to the fingernail test....I don't think the mr. Clean magic eraser has any acetone in it, but the really nice thing about those is, you can use them wet or dry. Wet sanding works best for second coats...adding clear, after you prime, removing runssssss.. Been there way too many times, till I learned to do light coat build up !!!..We will see if this works tomorrow morning...
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Post by 1oldrobot on Jul 31, 2012 20:51:22 GMT -5
great info. that may be a big contribution in the world of jumbo fixes and customization. thanks for all the tips. as for this brushed steel thing i have, it has been suggested to me to acid bath it and just have it chromed (as long a its out of my customers pocket and not my own). im excited to hear about your results tomorrow.
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Post by lexcars2007 on Aug 1, 2012 3:27:39 GMT -5
Well I woke up an couldn't wait until morning. The test worked as good as the first try! it holds up very well, but if I push very hard with my fingernail it will chip/peel. But hind site is 20/20...skip back.....The first time i re painted a Hot wheels, I sanded it down light coats of primer from a can, then light coats of spray paint...it looked awesome. i put it all together, and while putting the bottom on, it was a tight fit and the great paint job chipped !!! I painted a few more the same way, and when the boys were playing with them, paint would chip !! Well why does it not chip that easy on an original paint job? Hardener. Hardener, Hardener, Thats why the paint chips on the Jm when I push my fingernail down it. Now the sanded arm is 50 % harder to chip than the none sanded one. I will airbrush one tomorrow, adding Hardener, and that should be the key factor...The flex additive would be ideal for an item like Draguns cape. One thing for sure, once you try the Mr. Clean magic eraser, you will fall in love, it's soft, flexes around items, fills in cracks because it's so soft. And only puts super fine scratches in the item. And when wet, polishes clear plastic, removes the yellowing that happens with age. IT WILL NOT MAKE THE CLEAR PLASTIC LOOK LIKE GLASS, because it does put those super fine scratches in it, but I did use it on old Hot wheels/Matchbox cars windows that had paint or bigger scratches in it. Test it out on a few different items, and see the different results from using it wet or dry. Maybe I'll take a few pictures tomorrow, and show the results..QUESTION, do I just add a normal photo from my picasa ? Or do I need to make it a special size so you can see it better ? Thank you all, for making me feel like I'm at home here...I have really gotten a great warm welcome..THANK YOU ALL |
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Post by 1oldrobot on Aug 1, 2012 5:55:54 GMT -5
awesome to read the results. im out tomorrow on some of my rounds for supplies so i will pick it up and try it out. ive thought about hardener, but ruled against it since i figured there was just no chance on jumbos. this can really change the way folks reading customize. as for photos, i dont really know how to attach multiple files or large files in this forum. some folks do obviously. picasa works best, i think.
a lot of the people active in the jumbo machinder section of this site customize and repro items, or are hardcore enthusiasts that would still find the info interesting.
to say the least, we are glad to have you around!
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Post by lexcars2007 on Aug 1, 2012 13:19:50 GMT -5
Thank you
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Post by lexcars2007 on Aug 6, 2012 14:20:54 GMT -5
Well i just finish up another test, I scuffed the upper leg of Mazinga with the Mr. Clean magic eraser...then I used my airbrush and used an enamel paint, I bought this paint through the REDLINE SHOP. its the Spectraflame paint that used for repainting vintage Redline cars...and I used a Hardener. I sprayed 2 light coats, let dry...and I can NOT chip the paint . It is a very strong bond, I'm going to try a few more coats to see if it holds up just the same...we will see |
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Post by lexcars2007 on Aug 7, 2012 22:36:54 GMT -5
Well right now, I have 4 coats of paint on the leg, and i threw it on a cement floor, and no chips !!! I guess the trick is hardener.
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Post by 1oldrobot on Aug 7, 2012 23:41:18 GMT -5
awesome, ill give it a try. i really could have used that info when i tried painting PE a few months ago. i did try to paint a 1/16" textured sheet of PE using your methods and it worked pretty good.
i used hardener on both, one scuffed, one left how i got it.
the paint job "sticks" pretty well. its more of a molded on shell.
i could get both to come right off by bending the painted sheet, but the scuffed one put up a pretty good fight before separating.
im not sure a lot of people will want to scuff shogun warriors from the 70's, but it does help me since i work with PE and PP for art stuff. as long as i dont bend it, it seems like this method works fine. like vinyl, weighted PE will sag so ill have to steer clear of surfaces with a lot of tension on them. got any pics of what the finish looks like?
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